Cameron to NY?

A trade could have gone down overnight with Cameron going to NY for Melky Cabrera. Also heard it reported on ESPN this morning.

11 months ago oconnobe 49 comments 0 recs |

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This is being reported all over the place now. People who understand baseball much better than me: please come on here and tell me what to think about this move. Is it just a salary dump?

http://nohuddleoffense.blogspot.com

by No Huddle Offense on Dec 11, 2008 7:22 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Yes

Salary dump, yes, but I think the Brewers get a quality guy in return.

If Sabathia were to have stayed, the Brewers would be more than a .500 team, thus Cameron would probably still be around. In the long run, this is a good move. Bad news is that we’ll all be dead in the long run.

My non-embarrassing thoughts on the Brewers:
Two Fisted Slopper

by nmc on Dec 11, 2008 8:22 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

insult to injury

by ol Pete on Dec 11, 2008 7:40 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I'm thinking the "Best Friend" clause was invoked here.

As such, the Yankees must fill at least 15 of 25 spots on their roster with Sabathia’s best friends.

I don't specifically articulate my motives, because that wouldn't travel as well as a boo does.

by KLSnow on Dec 11, 2008 7:40 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

That means Bill Hall goes to NY, right?

right?
please?
right?

Brewers fan lost in South Carolina.

by SCBrewer on Dec 11, 2008 7:47 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe

So saith the Nameless One.

But here’s the interesting part – the Yankees would like to expand the trade to include Brewers third baseman Bill Hall. The Brewers were giving serious consideration to expanding the deal if what they received in return for Hall made sense to them.

It's called "playing the percentages."

by hilbelink on Dec 11, 2008 7:53 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please…

http://nohuddleoffense.blogspot.com

by No Huddle Offense on Dec 11, 2008 9:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Please Not Melky…. How is that an upgrade – or even a parallel move?

by Saberilliterate on Dec 11, 2008 7:48 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Don’t the Brewers have to get some sort of usable pitching in return for this to make baseball sense? I can understand they might want to dump some salary, but The Formerly Moustachioed One has not really shown in the past that he makes trades simply to dump salary. That would be out of character, wouldn’t it?

It's called "playing the percentages."

by hilbelink on Dec 11, 2008 7:56 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

this trade seems dumb and i don't get it

someone, anyone, does this even make sense? or am i going off the deep end here?

I untuck my shirt!

by Michael M on Dec 11, 2008 8:21 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Keep in mind, they get four years of Cabrera and although, they lose a lot of power, they also lose a lot of strikeouts and get a left-handed bat. He’s also only 24.

by vealoscar on Dec 11, 2008 8:22 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

So what if he's 24

Remember, he’s 24, and SUCKS

I just sit back and root for the taser

by Hyatt on Dec 11, 2008 8:25 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

They also lose a lot of OBP and power

They’re dumping salary with this move, and basically getting another Tony Gwynn Jr. for the roster. Except that TG is actually a good defender.

by Marty McSuperFly on Dec 11, 2008 8:59 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

It's funny because it's true.

Except it’s sad instead of funny.

I have an unreasonable dislike of Bill Hall.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Dec 11, 2008 12:34 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I cannot let this slide

Strikeouts DO NOT MATTER AT ALL NOT ONE BIT.

Power does.

Side of plate batter hits on is only a little relevant.

And neck size to baby eating ratio.

by Jordan M on Dec 11, 2008 9:35 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Not saying you're wrong...

… but I thought you were Doug Melvin until I read the last line.

I have an unreasonable dislike of Bill Hall.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Dec 11, 2008 12:36 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

perhaps the salary dumb foretells

another signing or frees up space in the coming years if hall is also included…

I untuck my shirt!

by Michael M on Dec 11, 2008 8:24 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Say it with me...

Adrian Beltre!

Well, we did overextend ourselves financially last season in our playoff push. Maybe this is the flip side to that coin too: a $40 million 2009 payroll.

"I will agree that the attitude [at BCB] is ridiculous and they have done so much to instigate animosity and then block us from responding. Real mature!"

by roguejim on Dec 11, 2008 8:29 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I saw this and my first thought was....

seriously? Are you kidding me? Melky Cabrera? He of the Kendal-esque .648 OPS? This guy couldn’t beat out any of their aging fielders.

And isn’t Cabrera Arbitration Eligible now?

Couldn’t we have gotten Brett Gardner?

I just sit back and root for the taser

by Hyatt on Dec 11, 2008 8:24 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

The numbers

We know Cameron was owed $10 million this season. Hall is owed $8.4 million this season and $9.25 million next season.

Cabrera, on the other hand, is owed less that $500,000. Interestingly, Tom H. says that if Cabrera doesn’t work out, the Brewers think Lorenzo Cain will be ready in 2010.

It would also leave Suppan as the only player making more than $5 million, though Fielder will be joining him soon enough. After losing Sheets, CC, Shouse, Gagne, Torres, and possibly Cameron and Hall, that’s a LOT of payroll being shed

I wonder: if Hall is traded, with McGehee be on the team opening day. Surely we’re not looking at a full season of Mike Lamb…

"I will agree that the attitude [at BCB] is ridiculous and they have done so much to instigate animosity and then block us from responding. Real mature!"

by roguejim on Dec 11, 2008 8:25 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Cain

Strange that TH thinks Cain is the guy in waiting … unless he plays stellar defense or something. I hope the Gwynn talk dies down now.

Today’s going to be an changeful day: http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/35959644.html

My non-embarrassing thoughts on the Brewers:
Two Fisted Slopper

by nmc on Dec 11, 2008 8:33 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Career OPS+ of 84
Career OPS of 703

I don’t care if he is only 24 – it really isn’t much of an upgrade of the fall back of TGjr.

And he is Arby eligible – what is his expected pay range going to be??

by Saberilliterate on Dec 11, 2008 8:29 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Nobody's happy with this one

After reading the fan posts on the OFFICIAL site I have to say I don’t think Yankee fans are any happier with this deal than we are.

"Anybody with ability can play in the big leagues. To last as long as I did with the skills I had, with the numbers I produced, was a triumph of the human spirit." Source: Catcher in the Wry (Bob Uecker, 1982)

by travwood81 on Dec 11, 2008 8:35 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Here is a Yankees blog thoughts on Melky from October.

by ol Pete on Dec 11, 2008 8:35 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

This what I see thats good about the trade

I think we are just getting rid of some salary, obviously, and also we feel that Melky can return to his .360 OBP numbers of a few years ago. We definitely need OBP much more than the power/strikeouts that Cameron brought to the table. We have enough power on the rest of the team, we just need to get guys on base in front of these guys.

Also, quality CF are rare in the game right now so its not like we are going to get an all-star centerfielder by only trading Cameron. So I guess dumping salary for a guy that has the potential to fill a major gap in our offense isn’t the worst idea.

by ajoconnor on Dec 11, 2008 8:38 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I see the salary dump

and I’m a guy who sometimes looks at a player’s history and hopes for a return to his best performance, perhaps irrationally. But .360 was a few years ago. Looking at his stats isn’t a pleasant experience.

by ol Pete on Dec 11, 2008 8:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I hear ya

Pete – as a Yanks fan I think there is some upside to this. I really think splitting up Melky and Robinso Cano will do wonders for both of them. Apparently, and I have no proof of this, those two are buddy buddy and love to hit the town together often. Is it a coincidence that when Cano got paid last year both him and Melky’s stats took a hit? Maybe. But as a 30 year old man living in NYC I can verify that it’s very easy to get wrapped up in the glitzy nightlife…I cant even imagine being a bachelor playing for the Yanks who is a multi-millionarie that comes from poverty.

Hopefully Melky settles down and uses some of his potential to get himself a small contract.

by TimQMills on Dec 11, 2008 8:59 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Well that shouldn't be too hard.

I’m sure just being in Milwaukee alone will settle the guy down.

by goirish2107 on Dec 11, 2008 9:45 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Hopefully he can turn it around.

Because if he was a guy who overenjoyed the nightlife and underperformed in New York, and he doesn’t improve in Milwaukee, he’ll spend a year or two as a guy who spends a lot of time alone, followed by a return to poverty.

I don't specifically articulate my motives, because that wouldn't travel as well as a boo does.

by KLSnow on Dec 11, 2008 10:09 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

If this

does go down as a straight swap I would have to believe that Melvin has something bigger up his sleeve.

by ACB on Dec 11, 2008 9:12 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

he better

because this trade is ridiculous. We better be signing Fuentes after freeing up that much of the payroll. Big Unit too. There better be some pitching prospect involved in there that we just haven’t heard about yet, otherwise this is one of the worst trades I’ve ever seen.

by BrewHaHeather on Dec 11, 2008 10:07 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Screw the Unit

give me Derek Lowe

I just sit back and root for the taser

by Hyatt on Dec 11, 2008 10:36 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

yes, Lowe would be better. But then again, so would CC or Burnett. I’m trying to stay closer to reality

by BrewHaHeather on Dec 11, 2008 11:46 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Melvin says we’re not on Lowe’s list.

by ol Pete on Dec 11, 2008 12:12 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe we could use the cleared payroll

to sign a player that’s a 2-4 win upgrade over one we have right now for $10 million :)

And neck size to baby eating ratio.

by Jordan M on Dec 11, 2008 10:10 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

that pretty much says it all, right there.

Also, cheese.

by Jeff Sackmann on Dec 11, 2008 9:07 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

We have to be getting something else

or they have to be taking Hall and expanding the deal. We could just auction off Mike Cameron as a rental to someone and get a better return than Melky Cabrera.

Just to put this in perspective:
Cabrera .293 wOBA
Cameron .355

Cabrera -11.3 UZR/150
Cameron 6.6

At least a 2-3 win downgrade if its a staight-up deal. I could care less if he’s under team control for 4 years if he’s replacement level.

We better get a pitcher or something else in this deal or I will be mad.

And neck size to baby eating ratio.

by Jordan M on Dec 11, 2008 9:47 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I always assumed

Cameron would be dangled as a mid-season trade, if the Crew weren’t in the thick of the playoff hunt come July 09.

I also agree that we could do a heck of a lot better than Melky straight up. So we’d better be getting more than that.

by Brew Angel on Dec 11, 2008 4:05 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

i'm getting the feeling that people aren't happy with the trade, haha

is it just b/c cabrera is that bad?

i thought 10mil for cameron was overpaying and considering the rest of our lineup, it says a lot that he played a month less than everyone else and still led the team in Ks

"Cubs fans boo again – 99% of these people can’t see the plate." -Ueck

by dux2bux on Dec 11, 2008 10:21 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Look at his power too though

Cabrera is that bad, and Cameron is one of the best defensive CF, which is important for the Brewers with deficiences around the field defensively.

Offensively, Ks don’t matter, if you ground out instead of K, it is still an out. What matters is producing runs, and Cameron’s power.

The designated hitter rule is like letting someone else take Wilt Chamberlain's free throws.

by Kyguy922 on Dec 11, 2008 10:23 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

led the team in Ks

Irrelevant. What if Melky Cabrera leads the team in weak groundballs?

10mil for cameron was overpaying

If he’s at least 2 and maybe 4 wins better than Cabrera, it’s not. I don’t object to trading him. I object to trading him straight up for Melky Cabrera. If there’s another piece I’m fine with it.

And neck size to baby eating ratio.

by Jordan M on Dec 11, 2008 10:28 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

There better be a bigger signing

Clear the payroll to make room for a solid player… I don’t want it to be Fuentes, because we won’t have any save opportunities with Cabrera and Lamb as our CF/3B. Beltre would make me happier, or any solid starting pitcher.

The salary dump is unfortunate, because unless something happens soon, I am going to have to lower expectations further for the next year. Playoffs are looking more like a 2010 or 2011 thing, if ever.

The designated hitter rule is like letting someone else take Wilt Chamberlain's free throws.

by Kyguy922 on Dec 11, 2008 10:21 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Interesting move

It’ll be good to free up some salary for the new hot shots coming in.

"If loving CC is wrong I do not want to be right"
"If lovin’ Braun is wrong, I want to be a repeat offender"

by kirbir on Dec 11, 2008 10:35 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

Would Cameron be a Type A next year? or even a Type B?

by Saberilliterate on Dec 11, 2008 11:47 AM CST reply actions 0 recs

I would think that his hr and sb totals combined with his position would make him a type A for sure.

by Trent Durrington on Dec 11, 2008 3:38 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

I think it depends

I vaguely recall having the same thought, but being told that Cameron won’t be compared to centerfielders (where he’d easily be a Type A) but to all outfielders, where, not so much.

"I will agree that the attitude [at BCB] is ridiculous and they have done so much to instigate animosity and then block us from responding. Real mature!"

by roguejim on Dec 11, 2008 4:48 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

He was (or would have been) a Type B this year

link. If he puts up numbers similar to his last two seasons next year, he shouldn’t fall out of Type B range.

Obscure baseball records and more at my blog, Recondite Baseball.

by TheJay on Dec 11, 2008 4:55 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

Would we offer him arb though?

He’d be type B for sure, but we’d probably have to pay him $10-$13 million.

And neck size to baby eating ratio.

by Jordan M on Dec 11, 2008 6:19 PM CST up reply actions 0 recs

We offered it to Ben Sheets….

by Saberilliterate on Dec 12, 2008 8:04 AM CST up reply actions 0 recs

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