Parra's Workload

by MadJimiBrewha on Mar 16, 2008 1:18 PM CDT Comment 16 comments

After another stellar outing by Parra yesterday I got curious about his past workload. Here are his yearly IP according to The Baseball Cube:
2002 - 49.2
2003 - 138.2
2004 - 73.1
2005 - 91.0
2006 - 86.0
2007 - 133.0

Assuming he is past his arm problems, it is conceivable that even if he makes the team out of spring training we are not going to have a full year of him. If you use this law of 30 that everybody was referencing with Gallardo, we probably shouldn't expect more than 160-165 innings. That being the case, what is the best way to distribute those innings or do we consider him a special circumstance that isn't bound by that 30 inning rule because he is older than Gallardo?

Poll

If limited by his IP totals, how would you prefer Parra's innings be controlled?

aaa to start the season to keep his IP down before a mid-season call up

23 votes

ride him from the start of the season right up till he hits his limit

8 votes

start him off in the bigs, shut him down mid-season with an allotment of innings remaining so he could be used down the stretch

9 votes

throw IP out the window and ride him all year long

17 votes

other

8 votes

65 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs | Comment 16 comments

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Comments

tricky

I would say the workload would be a bad reason to send him down -- i mean, if we send him down he's still going to start; the only difference would be that he might be pulled a little earlier. So if he gets sent down for two months, that saves what? 15 innings?

This is a good reason to "maintain the depth", though. Based on what we've seen so far, I would give Parra a rotation slot, and if everything goes well--he pitches well, he stays healthy--deal with the innings when that comes up. If he hits 150 or so and starts flagging, send him down or send him to the 'pen, but it seems like since he's pitching so well, we might as well get whatever we can out of him for as long as it's safe to expect his arm to work.

Weird, but not weird.

by Jeff Sackmann on Mar 16, 2008 1:44 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

second that, the tricky part

its so hard to determine how to allot his innings without knowing who is gonna end up in the rotation. i feel like vargas will be in there unless he is dealt (i feel he would be the first to go). bush is coming around, and i think he also gets a spot. cappy honestly would best be served in the minors to work his problems out, but does anyone think he gets sent down? i can't see us getting rid of him due to his being a lefty, parra most likely starting in the minors, and only having shouse in the pen (unless we keep stetter/choate) i don't see us having yo, villa, and parra all in the rotation early in the season, and since yo is due back sooner than later, him and villa probably go in the rot., and parra goes down. therefore, since he'll be starting, i guess you just limit his innings to start the year, and he stays till someone gets traded/injured/sucks, then call him up and ride him. he threw 130 something a few years ago, as well as last year, i think you can bump him up more than the 30 rule.

by goirish2107 on Mar 16, 2008 1:58 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

160 innings seems to be the consensus

I wouldn't be upset if they sent him down for a month or two to start the year- or let him pitch in Gallardo's place until he comes off the DL, and then sent him down.

If they can limit his innings at AAA, then they can call him up and ride him through August and September.

I'm just afraid that if he starts the year in the rotation, Ned would figure out that he's really good and burn him up right away. Then they'd be stuck throwing Capuano, Bush, or Vargas (assuming they're all still on the roster) in important games in August and September.

And in response to your opinion, Jeff, I agree but I think pitching in the minors goes beyond gaining "15 innings" or so. They can keep his work consistent down there, and there isn't as much stress on his arm working to AAA batters as there is in the MLB.

That being said, if he starts the year in the rotation, I won't complain. He deserves it. I just hope we still have him in September.

by Jordan M on Mar 16, 2008 2:33 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

i don't know

I think it is reasonable to assume that the Brewers could try to limit his innings, but he does not have a young arm. He's been in the bigs long enough (even though he hasn't logged too many innings) that the innings pitched should not be a concern. Ned Yost nor Doug Melvin have even talked about it yet, so I do not think it is an issue.

Innings pitched becomes an issue for pitches as young as Gallardo, 20-23 range. Parra is 25. He is close to his "peak performance age," so his arm should be something the Brewers can ride all season. I think that can be seen in the way the Brewers are treating him in Spring Training. They are trying to get him more innings...not less.

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by jimmyb1799 on Mar 16, 2008 3:23 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

However,

he threw about 130 innings last year, and most organizations don't want to increase a young pitcher's workload more than 30 innings a year. And considering Parra's injury history, he's worth keeping an eye on.

by Jordan M on Mar 16, 2008 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

6-man?

I heard that the red sox were toying with the idea of a 6-man rotation last year. would this make sense here -- at least for part of the season -- given the 'surplus' of starters, especially guys who are liable to break down (sheets), or guys whose innings we'd want to limit (parra and gallardo)? maybe if we still have depth come august, switch to a 6-man rotation depending on what the standings look like. i don't know -- i haven't thought this through enough. maybe one of you guys have and have something to say about why this is a bad or good idea (in theory or practice)?

"Cover your flesh." - Bill Haverchuck

by baumann on Mar 17, 2008 6:25 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Interesting Idea

I hadn't thought of that. It would maybe make sense to do for part of the year, assuming all of Parra, Gallardo, and Villanueva (and Sheets, of course) are in it. Otherwise, it would just be an opportunity to further dilute the staff by pitching 6 average pitchers instead of five.

by Jordan M on Mar 17, 2008 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

With 6 pitchers

we would have to wait an extra day for guys like sheets and gallardo.

by brewfan2 on Mar 17, 2008 7:34 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

That is the problem, of course

by Jordan M on Mar 17, 2008 8:16 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

What about starter by committee?

Sheets and Vargas are paired up. Gallardo and Suppan, Parra and Bush, and Villanueva and Cappy are the other pairs. We go with a "four" man rotation. Both members of a pair are (almost) guaranteed to work every fourth day. If our relievers are well-rested, the starter gets pulled before his second AB (in the 8th spot of course), and is replaced by the co-starter. Otherwise, we try to get the starter through 5+ or 6. If at that point he is still under 75 pitches, he can keep going. If not, he tags out and his partner tags in.

Maybe the pairs could be a bit flexible. If Sheets throws a complete game, Vargas may start the next game and the partners would shift one spot as appropriate. I'd be happy to help Yost and Maddux keep track of innings and who needs a start.

Three or four guys in the bullpen are on clean-up duty... Gagne, Turnbow, Shouse and maybe McClung, just for fun.

Ichiro, on facing Daisuke Matsuzaka for the first time: "I hope he arouses the fire that's dormant in the innermost recesses of my soul."

by DaleCoop14 on Mar 18, 2008 2:53 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Hey

you stole my idea from last year regarding a Bush/Vargas/Cappy combo.

As long as a combo of 2 of them can get through 6 innings.

Lordz Of Vengeance....Sometimes I drink...Okay...I drink most of the time.

by Dikembe Meiztombo on Mar 18, 2008 3:15 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Or...How about

A pitching staff consisting of no starters. Just have a team of relievers who pitch 1 or 2 innings every other day. Here could be the pitching lineup for the 2 days.

Game 1: Sheets 2 innings, Suppan 2 innings, Manny 2 innings, Mota 1 inning, Torres 1 inning, Gagne 1 inning.

Game 2: Gallardo 2 innings, Vargas 2 innings, Villy 2 innings, Shouse 1 inning, Riske 1 inning, Turnbow 1 inning.

Each guy gets a day off to rest and then they're right back at it after their day off. If pitch counts are low, some pitchers could go over 2 innings. This would also leave 5 hitters on the bench and theoretically could bat for the pitcher every AB.

by brewfan2 on Mar 18, 2008 3:18 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

We would

have the fewest wins by starting pitchers in the history of baseball... zero. There's an added bonus to the 4-man tag-team rotation. We should regularly be able to go through a 4-game series with opposing hitters never facing one of our pitchers more than twice.

Ichiro, on facing Daisuke Matsuzaka for the first time: "I hope he arouses the fire that's dormant in the innermost recesses of my soul."

by DaleCoop14 on Mar 18, 2008 5:12 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Problems

Shouse 1 inning = :(
If someone implodes, say Turnbow is having a bad day and gives up 5 runs without getting an out, you don't have anybody to go to.

I like the concept, but there's a few too many problems with it to actually consider using it.

by Jordan M on Mar 18, 2008 6:03 PM CDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly

Lordz Of Vengeance....Sometimes I drink...Okay...I drink most of the time.

by Dikembe Meiztombo on Mar 18, 2008 3:20 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

Other

I voted other because I would just start him in the bigs right now and limit his pitches thrown (more than IPs) in every start. Then let him pitch the whole season if it works out that way.
vr, Xei

by Xeifrank on Mar 18, 2008 5:36 PM CDT reply actions 0 recs

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