Hoffman signs with Brewers
The good news is that the Brewers just signed Trevor Hoffman, per Buster Olney. It's expected to be a one-year deal with a mutual option for 2011. The bad news: Trevor will be making $8 million next season. Hell's bells!
over 2 years ago
roguejim
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F*CK AND YES
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
I'm ok with this
It means our bullpen is pretty much set. Now all DM has to worry about for the next four months is figuring out a way to trade Hardy for King Felix.
It is what it is.
ha
Hernandez is going nowhere.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions
Nevermind,
I thought he was in his last year of arbitration, turns out he has two years left. Too bad the Braves don’t need a shortstop.
It is what it is.
I wouldn't be surprised either way.
Hart, Hardy, Parra, Weeks, Gamel.. is that enough? Remember, Jack drafted all of those players.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
The Mariners are a large market team, and are close to contending in a weak AL West
They have a lot of expiring contracts, but could easily improve and keep payroll at around the $100-$115M level and field a very competetive team next season. They are also the best defensive team in all of baseball, so if they add another good SP via free agency, they’ll be set.
I just can’t see Jack selling off one of the best pitchers in MLB just because they finished 3rd this year in the AL West. They improved markedly vs. 2008, and largely thanks to Jack’s moves.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions
With his 0-3 yesterday ...
Hall finished with a batting average of .200 for the M’s, just under his .201 mark for the Crew.
Good work, Bill.
Possibly, but I wouldn't count on Snell for anything
And the response wasn’t about next year anyway.
You know me Al.
I don't know, I like Snell
He’s sort of the Pirates(now M’s) version of Manny Parra.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions
He was able to unload Yuniesky Betancourt
which, in and of itself, makes up for any of the moves that didn’t pan out.
He also was able to sell high on Washburn…juuuuuust before he regressed in a huge way. I think that’s shrewd.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions
All I'm saying is I wouldn't be surprised.
It’s not a matter of where they finished last year. It’s a matter of whether or not they can lock him up long term. The M’s are going to try for an extension with him first. If that fails, we could very well see a trade.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
I don't agree with that, personally
Sabathia netted LaPorta and Brantley and two throw in prospects. For 3.5 months of his service. I think if the Mariners trade him, they wait until the deadline in 2011, the year before he becomes a free agent. They’ll still net a huge haul for him.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Also
Doug has come out and said he’s going to be very aggressive in finding SP. The fact that Hoffman signed for so much makes me believe DM has a trade in mind. I would guess that whatever he was ‘so close’ to getting done at the deadline will be revisited and finalized, now that the time constraint has been removed.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
Deadline talks with M's were for Washburn
Dougie’s said that.
Mark my words: Felix Hernandez in a Brewers uniform is a pipe dream, at best.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
"Dougie" didn't say who the 3 team deal was for.
I’ve heard it was for the King, but I’m not sure how much stock I put in that. Either way, Jack admitted that he at least listened to offers for Hernandez, so I wouldn’t be surprised if he ends up being traded at some point. You’re probably right, though, I’m guessing they would wait til the deadline.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
I'll do some searching in a bit
But I’m about 99.9% sure I read words out of his mouth that said they tried for Washburn.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions
They did try for Washburn
but there was a much, much bigger deal on the table for Hernandez that probably didn’t have a prayer of happening.
E: George 4 (5, throw, throw, throw, throw).
Yeah I seem to recall some of that
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 2:56 PM CDT up reply actions
I would LOVE to know the details of that deal
"my goodness"
by BrewHaHeather on Oct 5, 2009 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed
This is a team that paid big for Adrian Beltre and pays Ichiro $18 million a year. They will move hell and high water to sign Hernandez, and they will go as long as they can to try and sign him.
I wonder if they wont be the kind of team that would pursue John Lackey this offseason.
I dont know so much about “Jack’s moves” apart from bringing in Wakamatsu as the manager and making a culture change in the locker room. His trades were quite unspectacular.
I could see them going after Lackey as well
Although a rotation with
1. Felix Hernandez
2. Ian Snell
3. Ryan Rowland-Smith
4. Brandon Morrow
5. Luke French
Is not particularly bad. Put Rowland-Smith in the BP and sign Lackey, and that’s a pretty decent starting 5.
Like I said above, trading Washburn at the perfect time and being able to get rid of Betancourt, in my eyes, were very nice moves. Don’t forget the trade that netted them 7 players last off-season, including Gutierrez, that sent Putz away at the right time, brought back Heilman who in turn netted Cedeno and Garrett Olson.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Ok
French then.
Or Morrow.
Or Snell.
Whatever.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I think he meant batting practice
;)
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
Eh
You have the Angels, and then everyone else. You’re certainly entitled to your opinion, but I beg to differ.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 6:04 PM CDT up reply actions
Well, okay. I guess...
Signing someone is now out of the questiong. Put on your trading shoes, DM, it’s time to bring a good starter in.
I think I'm ok with it.
It’s around the max I would pay him, wonder what his contract clauses are.
Now if only fixing the rotation was so easy.
Welcome Back, Doug Davis!
Sigh.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 11:04 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I disagree
Doug Davis is signable… His contract has expired.
Doug Davis made a league leading 34 starts, with a 4.12 ERA — which makes him acceptable to Brewer brass.
I am not sure that Davis wouldn’t be an improvement over our 2009 rotation either.
That said, I’d probably take a melon-baller to my eye-sockets if our rotation for 2010 was Yo/Soup/Loop/Bush/Davis
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Oct 5, 2009 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Yo/Soup/Loop/Bush/Davis
no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no nooooooooooooooooo
Yo, Buchholz [or equiv], Bush, Davis, Parra / Narveson / Butler with Suppan as long reliever / spot start
that’d be ok
How are the Brewers going to end up with Buchholz?
I’m just curious how you see that going down?
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions
I did say Buchholz or equivalent
but I dunno, something like JJ + Gamel could get probably a young front of the rotation kind of guy
if Gamel’s not going to get a shot at third they might as well flip him for pitching
My opinion
Is that Buchholz is not attainable with what the Brewers have.
You have to aim a little lower, as Hardy’s value isn’t nearly as high as it once was. Michael Bowden may even be a stretch.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions
No, there are few upgrades out there
But who thought Looper was going to come in and pitch well this year? Not me.
Doug Davis is just the kind of signing The Mustache will make-a guy coming off a career year.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Let's hope that The Mustache actually realizes this
Better late than never, I say. He can get out from under half of the Loopan for $1M.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:13 PM CDT up reply actions
I guess its cool that Hoffy seems to want to play for our team.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Oct 5, 2009 11:46 AM CDT reply actions
You're more depressing than Joey.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
by tcyoung on Oct 5, 2009 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
He will also probably pitch in his 1000th game
around the same time, which will be impressive as well.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Oct 5, 2009 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions
He's won't be worth $8 (he wasn't even this season)
But I guess they’re paying a premium to have a definite closer. You could try and go with cheaper internal options but as past seasons have shown that usually leads to confusion/inconsistency/disaster.
And at least I don’t feel the need to run for cover when Hoffman takes the mound, unlike some past investments…
Ryan Braun: He loves it.
'Superbad' would have worked as well.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Oct 5, 2009 12:42 PM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
The better answer would have been...
To go off of the board with “Derrick and Eric”
A hilarious movies about a couple former fireballers, played by Seth Rogen and Owen Wilson, who find themselves playing for the Southern Maryland Blue Crabs after flaming out of the big leagues. They rediscover their “blaze” when new pitching coach (played by Snoop Dogg), teaches they boys how to pitch “high and loose” instead of “high and tight”
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Oct 5, 2009 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs
I really think you made that up
and you need to be in development, as I would pay to see that
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
2010 Salaries:
Mariano Rivera – $15M
Francisco Cordero – $12M
Francisco Rodriguez – $11.5M
Brad Lidge – $11.5M
Joe Nathan – $11.25M
Brian FUentes – $9M
It is what it is.
And they're all way, way, way overpaid
None deserve to make half of what they are.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions
So is getting paid millions to act
Blame society, not the players.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:11 PM CDT up reply actions
I will say, however
That both Ben and Jerry deserve to make whatever it is they’re making. If not just for Triple Caramel Chunk, then for One Sweet Whirled and Phish Food.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions
How random
And yet, I agree with you whole-heartedly
Having troubles with wrapping my mind around Kirbir listening to T.I.
-Dikembe Meiztombo
i disagree with the flavors of choice
but agree with the sentiment.
by PagsBrewCrew on Oct 6, 2009 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm confused
what’s your argument?
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Here's the problem
it may be ridiculous, but 35,000 fans don’t come to my cube and watch me sell every day. No one is out to buy a Hyatt Shirzey. These players perform athletic feats that people pay to watch, sponsors line up to put their name next to, and people write about every day. So yes, they are playing a game, but they do earn their money (except Kendall and Suppan).
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
thanks
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Prince Fielder is nothing but a device for your avatar
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Oct 5, 2009 1:52 PM CDT up reply actions
That is his main purpose in life
beyond being awesome of course.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Don't buy now, wait until December when they're clearancing out the 2009 models
That’s when Shirzey’s are super cheap. If you can live with having ‘last year’s model’.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions
Thats the sole purpose for my trip up to MKE in Dec.
Frankly, my Sheets, Weeks, and CC Shirzeys aren’t cutting it any more. The Fielder one is still relevant, but I need to re-up
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Already done
thanks for the B-day present wife.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
And what number is Hyatt?
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
11
I’m actually Mike Rivera in disguise
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
I'd buy a Snuggie.
"I will agree that the attitude [at BCB] is ridiculous and they have done so much to instigate animosity and then block us from responding. Real mature!"
If you went to a single baseball game, or purchased mlb.tv
or bought a shirt/jersey… you have nobody to blame but yourself.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
I know you're being facetious
The point is, you can basically get the same value out of a pitcher making $1M.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
Being that the save stat is an utter joke
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions
I never said anything about free agency
Did you want to change the topic of the conversation?
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Sorry, I should've been more detailed in my response...
My point is that yes, you could probably find a pitcher who could pitch as well as these guys in a save situation making $1M, but once they’re eligbile for free agency, they’ll command a much higher salary.
Yeah, that's the nature of the beast in baseball
My point is that closers are overpaid all the time, and the save stat is a joke. Fangraphs has a nice post up about Hoffman, and point out that he hasn’t been worth $8M for years.
If you look at the top 10 relievers in terms of value this year, six of them are closers. Of those 6:
• John Broxton: $1.825M salary vs. $12.9M value
• Brian Wilson: $0.48M salary vs. $11.0M value
• Andrew Bailey: $0.40M salary vs. $10.6M value
• Rafael Soriano: $6.1M salary vs. $9.4M value
• Heath Bell: $1.255M salary vs. $9.0M value
• Mariano Rivera: $15M salary vs. $8.9M value
So, my point really is that teams would do well to find internal options to close games, and save the money for other parts of their roster construction. Matt Thornton was 2nd after Broxton, Mike Wuertz was 4th after Wilson, Phil Hughes was 6th after Bailey, and C.J. Wilson was 8th after Soriano, to round out the top 10 most valuable relievers. Those guys aren’t even closers.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:45 PM CDT up reply actions
I think the Yanks can justifying overpaying Rivera
I am sure he sells some merch.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Oct 5, 2009 1:51 PM CDT up reply actions
Oh yeah
They can justify overpaying anyone.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 1:56 PM CDT up reply actions
As does Hoffman
what jerseys do you see at MP?
1. Braun
2. Fielder
3. Hardy
4. Hoffman
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
I just wonder if everyone who wears a Hoffman Brewers jersey feels like a poser
Similar to anyone who wears a Favre Vikings jersey.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 3:05 PM CDT up reply actions
doubt it
Favre plays for the Vikes, thus his jersey is fine. Same with Hoffman. I doubt anyone wearing a Manny Dodgers Jersey feels any shame
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
I don't feel like Manny is a particularly good comparison
Favre would have been better had it been last season. That way, the comparison could be that they had both played their entire careers, broken and set records, with one team and then moved on.
I can’t wait to see him break 600 saves next season, and how ridiculously everyone celebrates. Nevermind that 550 of them weren’t recorded in a Brewers uniform.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions
Living in LA...
I think it’s safe to say that most people cheering hard for Manny have no shame whatsoever.
I'm not familiar with Fangraphs' "value", but...
as you alluded with your “beast” comment, players’ salaries are determined by what teams are willing to pay… not solely on their performance.
The problem with going with internal options is that you don’t know how they’re going to perform.
If they do well, eventually they’ll be able to get more money in free agency, which means that the team is stuck finding another young pitcher to finish games.
If they don’t do well… that means the team will lose games in the 9th inning.
Teams are willing to pay a premium for a proven closer to take this unknown out of the equation.
Teams lose games in innings 1-8 all the time
And as Matt Thornton will tell you, you can be a very, very useful reliever, better than every other reliever in all of baseball except John Broxton…and not be a closer.
And to the point that you ’don’t know what you’re going to get’…I’d say that if an organization can’t identify which pitchers can be shut down pitchers by the time they get to the big leagues, that organization is either the Milwaukee Brewers, or needs to reassess itself. I’ll bet Todd Coffey’s value would have been near Hoffman’s at the end of the year if he had pitched in higher leverage situations.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions
Identifying the shutdown pitchers is half the equation...
having them in the organization is the other half.
Also, if your statement is true about identifying shutdown pitchers, then why are so many teams “overpaying” for closers in baseball… particularly those heading to the playoffs?
For the same reason teams over pay for the wins stat for SP?
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 2:58 PM CDT up reply actions
I think MLB should've learned their lesson after
the Storm Davis-Royals debacle
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
How about Carlos Silva/Jeff Suppan?
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 3:32 PM CDT up reply actions
I agree with you on principal
but if the Brewers went internal (Coffey), they would have had to replace the setup man with somebody who has less value than Coffey (Difelice, Villanueva, Riske, McClung) Then they’d have to replace that player with somebody who has less value than him (Long Relief). And so on. Basically, the entire bullpen gets negatively effected. Having a shutdown closer really tightens up every aspect of the bullpen.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
I'm not disagreeing with having an outstanding pitcher pitch the 9th inning
I just think that any of the ‘big name closers’ out there are benefiting from a ridiculous stat.
Brian Fuentes has 48 saves this season. I don’t think anyone would rather have him at the back end of this bullpen. Also, anyone who pays any attention to baseball knew that last season was an utter fluke for Brad Lidge. But at the same time he proves the point: you can get the job done no matter who you are, really. I mean…if you’ve got a really high leverage situation in the 7th inning and you’re up by 1 run, shouldn’t you put your best pitcher in THEN, and not ‘save him’ for a ‘save situation’? If there’s a reliever pitching at that point, he’s going to get credited with a BS, and if he goes and finishes out the game, he’ll still get the SV.
I just think the whole idea is ridiculously over-rated. A team’s best reliever should pitch the highest leverage situation of every game, not always a specific inning.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions
The Book illustrates that point very well
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
I don't think that closers are benefiting...
simply from having alot of saves. Ignoring saves, many of the big name closers have very good stats… ERA, WHIP, BAA, etc.
Fuentes benefited from having a good season while with the Rockies. Despite having more saves this season, he actually pitched worse than last season.
I agree that teams would like to have their best reliever pitching in the highest leverage situation of every game, but you won’t know when that is until after the game is over. The problem is that this could happen anytime during the game… and multiple times. Unless the team is stocked with multiple shutdown relievers, they need to pick when to use them.
Right
But isn’t it clear that in a 1 run game, if the bases are loaded with no outs, that’s the highest leverage situation to that point in the game?
The A’s, Braves, and Dodgers all managed to have very good bullpens this season. The A’s and Braves both used multiple options at closer this season, and they had the best and second best team FIP in MLB this year.. I just think its silly to pay millions to a closer. If you have solid SP and good middle relief, you shouldn’t have to worry too much about the end of the game. And, like I said all off-season last year: who cares who’s sitting at the end of the bullpen if the SP can’t get him the ball with the lead?
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 3:38 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes...
in that situation that would be the highest leverage situation up to that point in the game. Granted, it could the 5th inning… and no one knows for sure if that won’t happen again later in the game.
Plus, that’s taking an extreme example. What about a one run game with a man on third with no outs? I’d say that’s equally as important… particularly if it’s the 9th inning. At least if it happens earlier in the game, the team has opportunities to score more runs.
Unless you have a bullpen full of good relievers (like those you mentioned – which isn’t the norm), you’d end up having to use a less than optimal pitcher at the end of a close game with runners on.
I think the Brewers DID have a bullpen full of good relievers this year
Their clutch rating wasn’t great, but they had a relatively low average leverage index anyway, due to the fact that the Starting pitching basically took them out of the game early. Also, the fact that they were used early and often is sort if immeasurable in all of this (although the Brewers ‘pen DID have the 5th most IP in all of MLB this season, if that tells you anything). If you look at Coffey’s numbers at fangraphs, he actually performed better in higher leverage situations than did Hoffman(clutch), but had a significantly lower overall average leverage index. Of course its extrapolation, but that tells me he could have performed better than Hoffman if he was given the chance.
This is starting to sort of get away from my point, though. Perhaps I should add the caveat that “for small market teams” its particularly ridiculous to spend a lot of money on a closer?
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 4:43 PM CDT up reply actions
I thought that The Mustache would give him $8.5M this season
So, its a savings over what I thought. But that’s more a testament to what I think about Doug Melvin than what I think a closer should get paid.
The biggest problem this team faces is SP. The only thing Dougie can do now is buyout Looper. That would give him $5.5M more in payroll than I had anticipated, and leave things at $69.5M. That $10.5-$15.5M would be nice for an SPthis season.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 3:40 PM CDT up reply actions
Only if you're assuming
that he’s limiting his search to FA pitchers (not looking for trades).
Granted, that’s not a bad assumption… and probably very realistic.
I don't think they're mutually exclusive
You can spend those dollars anywhere…FA or adding salary in trade, etc. That still doesn’t stop me from thinking that The Mustache is going to pick up Looper’s option. I hope he doesn’t, but I think he will.
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 4:45 PM CDT up reply actions
principle*
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
This is Fall Madness
Half price closers!
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
Madness
Having troubles with wrapping my mind around Kirbir listening to T.I.
by Dikembe Meiztombo on Oct 5, 2009 7:21 PM CDT up reply actions
THIS IS BASEBALL!!!
Having troubles with wrapping my mind around Kirbir listening to T.I.
by Dikembe Meiztombo on Oct 5, 2009 10:41 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Beer Prices
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
yeah...i was looking for that
forgot the names involved though;)
by PagsBrewCrew on Oct 6, 2009 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Fair Market Price
I’m pleased and a little surprised. He probably could’ve gotten at least another $1 MM in arbitration, right? He’s certainly amongst the elite closers based on his stats.
Very, very cool for all parties involved to have a contract worked out so quickly. I wonder how long negotiations have been ongoing. 2 weeks? September? End of August?
It also shows some faith in the 2010 squad. Even if he liked the management and the city, he wouldn’t sign a contract with a team he thinks will only win 75 games next year.
he wouldn’t sign a contract with a team he thinks will only win 75 games next year.
He stuck with the Padres for a long time, so I don’t think that point is valid.
That's all I've got for you today, unless you're interested in some Chris Capuano/Tom Haudricourt Fan Fiction.
The president exercises veto power
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
Too much monies
Having troubles with wrapping my mind around Kirbir listening to T.I.
by Dikembe Meiztombo on Oct 5, 2009 5:57 PM CDT reply actions
Though I'm happy he's coming back
Having troubles with wrapping my mind around Kirbir listening to T.I.
by Dikembe Meiztombo on Oct 5, 2009 5:57 PM CDT up reply actions
Your two above posts basically capture everything I think about this
Get out of my head!
I don’t have a category for "washed-up guys who may or may not be dominant big-league closers sometime soon."
~Jeff Sackmann
by Charlie Marlow on Oct 5, 2009 6:06 PM CDT up reply actions
Although $8million is too much
it is only about $1million more than this season due to the incentives he made for games finished and making the all-star team.
It sounds like the incentives affect his option
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
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NL Central Standings
| W | L | PCT | GB | STRK | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Chicago
|
0 | 0 | .000 | 0 | Lost 0 |
|
Cincinnati
|
0 | 0 | .000 | 0 | Lost 0 |
|
Houston
|
0 | 0 | .000 | 0 | Lost 0 |
|
Milwaukee
|
0 | 0 | .000 | 0 | Lost 0 |
|
Pittsburgh
|
0 | 0 | .000 | 0 | Lost 0 |
|
St. Louis
|
0 | 0 | .000 | 0 | Lost 0 |
(updated 2.12.2012 at 7:02 AM CST)
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