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Arizona Fall League Pitch F/X

The Arizona Fall League has given us an opportunity to get an extended look at three of the most interesting pitching prospects in the Brewer system. I'm just generalizing about their stuff here and not making any specific conclusions about their velocity based on one outing. I just wanted to give everyone a general idea of what these guys are throwing when we discuss them this offseason. 

Zach Braddock

He's a lefty who has had a lot of injury trouble in his career so far but is loaded with potential. He threw 42 innings in the minor league season, working on a schedule by throwing short outings every third day. 13.7 K/ 1.5 BB per 9 in the regular season. With that kind of ratio it's not hard to see why he's an exciting prospect. 64 strikeouts, 7 walks. In the AFL he's thrown 10 2/3 innings with 7 Ks, 4 BBs, and 1 run allowed.

I'll look at his outing on November 6th, in which he got a save, throwing a clean inning with 1 strikeout. It took 10 pitches-- 9 fastballs and a slider. His fastball average was 93.7 with a maximum of 94.6. That's impressive velocity and consistency for a guy with this kind of command of the strike zone. He also showed very good consistency in his release point for the fastball, and only dipped down a little bit on the slider. The slider was 83 and had some pretty good break of 4.5 inches towards a righty hitter. As far as I know, he also throws a changeup-- but probably hasn't needed to use it working in relief. Throwing 94 with good command is plenty for him right now. 

The Brewers will face a bit of a dilemma next year as they decide what to do with Braddock. He's probably ready to pitch in the MLB right now as a reliever, but sticking him in that role will limit his upside. If Braddock could stretch out and solidify his role as a starting pitcher down the road, we could be looking at a remarkably valuable player. There are only about 5 left-handed starters in the majors that are capable of averaging 92-93+ with the fastball, and Manny Parra is one of them. I know many people are down on Parra, but remember that Parra once was an injury-plagued lefty but had good stuff and control. He didn't make it to the majors until age 25. As exciting as it would be to have Braddock in the 2010 bullpen, the Brewers should weigh the benefits against what they could have down the road if they are patient. 

Mark Rogers

We all know the story here. He's even more of an underdog than Braddock considering he didn't even throw a pitch in a minor league game in 2007 or 2008 following 75 innings back in 2006. No one really expected anything from Rogers at this point, but the velocity is still there. In 63 innings at High-A Brevard County, he put up a K/BB ratio of 8.7: 4.7. He has really struggled in the AFL, but we can still learn plenty about his stuff. 

Rogers was roughed up in 27 pitches on November 13th, but it's the best sample of his stuff available. His average fastball was 93.6, and he hit 95.4. Rogers is continuing to work on a starter's repitoire, throwing 4 changeups, 8 sliders, and a curve along with 14 fastballs. The change averaged 84.2, a very nice complement to the fastball-- the approximate 9 mile per hour gap is close to ideal. The slider is also hard, at about 84, and seems to have tight break on it. The curve he threw came in at 78-- which qualifies as a pretty hard curve.

The stuff he has shown indicates that with health and time he easily has the upside of a high-quality major league starter. It's going to be a while, but he'll probably start next year with a cautious schedule in AA and the Brewers will have to see how things go from there.

Josh Butler

He was one of the fastest risers in the Brewers system this year, starting as a pitcher too old for high A. He had an interesting progression-- I was very skeptical of his promotion to AA because his A+ peripherals did not support his low ERA. But after being promoted to AA and then AAA, he was an entirely different pitcher: he had a K:BB ratio of about 5: 4 in high A and improved that to about 7: 2 in AA and AAA.

Butler described his stuff like this on his blog:

I am a power sink pitcher that works in the 88-92 mph range with my fastball for the most part. I also throw a curve, slider and change-up.

Looking at Butler's outing on October 22nd, when he faced Stephen Strasburg, it appears he undersold his fastball velocity a bit. 34 fastballs averaged 91.1 mph and he topped out at 93.4. And there's quite a lot of break on that fastball, 11 inches towards a righty on average is good stuff. He also seems to rely heavily on the curve and changeup, throwing 15 and 13 respectively to go with 3 sliders. The changes averaged 83.6, which is a little hard, and the curves were also power versions of that pitch, coming in around 79. The slider is pretty typical, about 84 without a whole lot of break.

Butler will probably get a decent look at a bullpen spot come spring but I think the Brewers will decide to start him at AAA to develop him as a starter. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see him up as a replacement at some point in 2010, especially if he can post some solid numbers there. I'll be intersted to see if he keeps up the peripheral success he started to achieve at AA and AAA last season.

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Comments

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Where do relievers come from?

You seem to favor developing these guys as starters so I’m curious as to where the relievers come from. DM seems to stick pretty heavily with cheap free agent guys to fill his bullpen rather than much along the lines of promotion. Is that typical?

Are some pitchers just built to be relief pitchers and groomed as such in the farm system? Are they primarily guys that aren’t quite good enough starters in AAA to make the jump to a major-league starter so they move to major league bullpen?

by ecocd on Nov 16, 2009 12:55 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Scrap heaps, typically

At least in a normal situation, most pitching prospects are given every opportunity to prove they can start, and only moved to the bullpen if they cannot. (See Stetter, Mitch.)

The value difference between a end-of-the-rotation starter and a middle reliever is enormous. If you’ve got a guy who could feasibly start, he should start until he proves he can’t.

That's all I've got for you today, unless you're interested in some Chris Capuano/Tom Haudricourt Fan Fiction.

by KLSnow on Nov 16, 2009 1:34 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I always thought

relievers are starters who only have 2-3 effective pitches.

"I will agree that the attitude [at BCB] is ridiculous and they have done so much to instigate animosity and then block us from responding. Real mature!"

by roguejim on Nov 16, 2009 11:35 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

When I think of a reliever who couldn't hack it as a starter ...

I think of a guy who has one “plus” pitch and not much else. Take Carlos Villanueva: has a very good change-up, a nondescript fastball, and that big, looping curveball that floats up there like a beach ball. He can get you three outs with that change-up, but if you ask him to run through a line-up two or three times, it gets dicey in a hurry.

by Rubie Q on Nov 17, 2009 6:57 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I think there are more pitchers who enter the system as relievers out of college

I believe the old tradition was start them until they showed they couldn’t start, usually because they didn’t have great secondary pitches. Pitcher roles have obviously changed over time, even into the college ranks, so there are more amateur relievers to grab.

Another way to say it is back when starters were supposed to go 7-8 innings every time out, there was no point in taking relievers in the draft but now that you need 3-4 innings a game from the bullpen, those reliever types are more useful.

Rooooo-guejim!

by TheJay on Nov 17, 2009 7:16 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Win Now Mode

If Braddock is better than anyone except the designated garbage guy in the pen (ie Julio), then someone Braddock should be in the pen now, rather than the starting rotation in a year or two.

Even though I don’t have much faith in our 2010 chances, I have even less faith in 2011 and 2012.

by PagsBrewCrew on Nov 16, 2009 1:26 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Here's my problem with Braddock in the pen

He’s left handed. Would Macha use him against righties, as he should, or would Braddock be effectively limited to short outings, simply because that’s how bullpen lefties are traditionally used?

That's all I've got for you today, unless you're interested in some Chris Capuano/Tom Haudricourt Fan Fiction.

by KLSnow on Nov 16, 2009 1:35 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Agree

I don’t see any need to rush Braddock, I agree that I don’t think he’d get to be more than a LOOGY if he is on the MLB team, better to see if he can start.

What is Roger’s timetable like? If he has another good year with limited innings in AA-AAA would the Brewers be open to bringing him up for the bullpen or are they going to do all they can to let him start? With his arm issues I wonder if the Brewers would take what they can get from him at this point, even if it is in the bullpen.

by Supertramp on Nov 16, 2009 2:11 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

I hate the idea of moving a guy to the pen to let him develop as a starter.

It just seems like a good way to stunt growth.

Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, "That’s all they need is another home run hitter".

by tcyoung on Nov 16, 2009 1:43 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

typo

for a second, I thought I f*cked up a then/than, but turns out it I just had an extraneous word

should read “Julio), then Braddock…”

my bad.

by PagsBrewCrew on Nov 16, 2009 3:16 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

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