Regardless of the reasons, we’ve got to find a way to throw the ball a little bit better for us to have success. When you’re constantly behind in games, it’s not easy and not fun.
Ryan Braun is not a fan of the Brewers' pitching. I wonder how stuff like this goes over in the clubhouse, though I don't really care since he's plainly correct.
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It's worked before.
I think he’s done this twice now? The team always responds well to it.
How it goes over in the clubhouse? When you come out and play everyday, and play everyday well. And put in the work, they have no choice but to respect you. He doesn’t whine and complain, when he says things he’s normally right.
im sure it didn't go over real well with burns.
but im sure that ryan thought about that and also how the rest might respond. he seems like he’d think it out before spouting off
If I was one of the pitchers I would counter with
Lets see in the last week we have lost a game 1-0 and a game 2-1 in 10 innings when the offense gets us 4 plus runs a night then they get to piss and moan about the starting pitching.
Let me spell it for you Cub fans O N E H U N D R E D A N D O N E Y E A R S
Braun did comment on the lack of hitting, as well...
“They certainly swung the bats better than we did as well. Clearly, they were the better team.”
“It was nice to at least get one win but they clearly outplayed us and outperformed us during the series.”
Um... Selective stats ftw?
Giving up 6.2 runs per game in our last 10 loses..If you take out the two games you mentioned its 7.3 runs per game in the last 8 loses.
4 runs per game huh?
He did specifically mention the Cubs pitchers vs. ours.
So if it’s selective stats, then he’s the one who selected the games from which they came. I don’t really dispute the notion that their starters are better than ours, but really, there were 2 good starts and one of the losses has to be put directly on the hitters. Would he have made the same comment if they had won the second game of the series and gotten a split?
I don’t know why I’m sniping at him because I think he’s right.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 5, 2009 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not excusing the hitters for those two loses.
Although I would argue, when facing good pitching you sometimes get 0-1 games. And I think thats only happened 3 or 4 games this year.
But because the offense lost 2 games that doesn’t excuse the pitching falling apart for the last 8 loses. Not only that, but its really only the starters that haven’t played well. I would guess that of that 6.2 run average, 4-5 runs have been in the first 5 innings of all those games. It’s tough to get motivated to come back that often, and by that much.
but how do we know that he hasn’t called them out in the clubhouse?
by Saberilliterate on Jul 5, 2009 8:35 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm assuming he has.
Sure hope so, because I suspect comments like these to the press would be even less popular if they didn’t come after similar comments made to other players.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 5, 2009 9:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Being right isnt always the best for morale
I agree with Kent in that you dont call out your teammates in the press.
Its a team game, you win and lose with your teammates. These types of comments dont go over well with teammates or organizations. It sounds a lot like a “blame game”, very Zambrano-like. High School.
All 25 guys on that roster are major league professional athletes. They know how badly or how well they are performing. Having a teammate call you out in the press ticks a lot of guys off, leads to a divided clubhouse, and makes Braun seem like he is better than everyone else. This type of comment can linger and cause big problems.
"All 25 guys on that roster are major league professional athletes. "
Except for Counsell, right?
Obscure baseball records and more at my blog, Recondite Baseball.
Zambrano-Like?
Yeah, because he screamed at the umpire, punched out the water-cooler (and a teammate) and threw a temper-tantrum on the field. You may not like what he said but he was right..and every other time he’s made a similar statement the team has responded. You call him Zambrano-like because you are a troll and you know how most people here feel about him.
by madwilbury on Jul 5, 2009 9:22 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
It could, but we don't know that it will or has in this instance.
It certainly not the first time he’s made comments like this in the press. Quite frankly, you’re perspective on this or virtually anything Braun does is suspect at best because you’re constantly on Braun for various aspects of his behavior, none of which have resulted in the outcomes you’ve predicted in the past.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 5, 2009 9:27 PM CDT up reply actions
"makes Braun seem like he is better than everyone else"
He is better than everyone else on this team.
:) + Suppan = :'(
Not much we can do.
Unless we empty our minor leagues or trade one of our high value players. I’m not a fan at all of emptying the minors (Keeping our salary concerns in line).
It really comes down to Parra and Bush being our saviors at this point. Unless Jack Z wants to spot us Eric Bedard for the rest of the season for some mid level prospect, I dont’ think we have many options that make sense for the long term survivability of the club.
agreed at this point a healthy Bush
Coupled with an even half together Manny Parra is our only really hope. Bush was pretty solid before he got beamed and who knows maybe Manny will bounce back from this trip to Nashville like Bush did last season.
Bush came back and was pretty solid after his trip to Nashville
A lot of baseball left to be played
Let me spell it for you Cub fans O N E H U N D R E D A N D O N E Y E A R S
An outsider's perspective-
Everything that I’ve always seen on Hardy makes me think that he’s really kinda overrated. If other teams value him as much as much of the media do, then I think he could bring a nice return…
His numbers aren’t very good this year, really… A little pop (9 HR’s) but other than that, he doesn’t steal (0/0) and only walks a little bit (.228/.300). I know that I am not attached to the team and players as most of you are, but I think he would be easy to part with for a good SP..
Seeking inspiration to fill this space...
by Andy Edwards on Jul 5, 2009 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions
I think he's kind of underrated
Even with a pretty bad first half of 09, he was 4+ wins above replacement in 07 and 08, and this year he’s still 1.3 WAR. He’s hitting lots of hard shots right at people, along with a lot of warning track shots (.255 BABIP) so it’s not that out there to think that’ll correct back to normal and stuff will start to drop or leave the park. He’s REALLY streaky though.
I think Hardy could and should get a very good young starting pitcher in return, someone like a Buchholz.
+10 caliber shortstops that can hit a little are extremely valuable
Hardy can hit better than league average. He definitely has been unlucky so far. If he’s an actual .220/.300/.350 hitter, of course he would not be all that great. But that’s a bit of an aberration.
E: George 4 (5, throw, throw, throw, throw).
No need to tell me about how SS's that can do ANYTHING at the plate are valuable :D
After all, I am a fan of a team that runs Tony Pena Jr. out there game after game – .169 & .097 AVG’s the past 2 years…
Seeking inspiration to fill this space...
by Andy Edwards on Jul 6, 2009 12:31 AM CDT up reply actions
Not to rip on Kansas City...
But that team is simply unbelievable
captainbok: What do you like the most about milwaukee
Jeff Suppan: Captain Bok, that is a great question. Does "Bok" mean Book of Knowledge? My favorite thing about Milwaukee are the Brewers.
You don't have to tell me that...
And, they just traded for Ryan Freel today! That makes FIVE MI’s on the roster right now. I have NO IDEA what Dayton Moore thinks he is doing. I hope prepping for more moves to come…
Seeking inspiration to fill this space...
Hardy AND Hart
for a very good arm.
Gamel and Escobar up, and next year we deal with the probable hole in CF.
by heybatterbatter on Jul 6, 2009 12:22 PM CDT up reply actions
It seems that the difference between this comment and previous Braun episodes
Is that he’s now going off on something he has no responsibility for. After last year’s Red Sox series, it was “We’ve all got to step it up.” This time, it’s more “We’re doing fine—those guys over there are what’s dragging us down,” sort of an us vs. them thing, as opposed to a “myself included” thing.
I think there’s a big difference, and I’m not sure this one will be received as well as those.
Ryan Braun
is destined to be a fucking distraction for this team, no matter how good he swings a bat. Give him time.
Correction: He is already.
If he has stuff like this to say, call a players’ meeting and lay it out in the sanctity of the clubhouse. Don’t bother the fans with it.
Let him get his own team, become a manager or maybe a color guy in the LA market.
I’m sure the pitchers agree with me…. ;-)
by heybatterbatter on Jul 5, 2009 10:24 PM CDT reply actions
Yeah but
Calling out the team is not his job. That isnt anyones job but the press and fans, and in the end it means nothing. These guys are paid to do a job, and its completely up to them to do that job and no one else. Braun’s comments only put an unecessary spotlight on an obvious issue, and if the players on the Brewers need a Braun inspired blaming to perform well, they have more problems than just winning or losing games.
And its been twice now this year.
Let's not act like this doesn't happen elsewhere.
Players call each other out sometimes, and not just in the MLB. It can have divisive effects, but it doesn’t always. It may not be “his job”, but it happens, and not just with Braun, sometimes to positive effect. You can say that if they need that kind of motivation they’ve got other problems, but we’ve all seen verbal shots taken at team mates (and sometimes physical ones) that immediately precede long winning streaks. I’m sure you’ll be disappointed if this doesn’t turn into the clubhouse problem you think it will. Your anti-Braun bias is showing once again…
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 5, 2009 11:48 PM CDT up reply actions
Call it a pro-Brewer bias.
It’s a team, not the individuals who happen to find their way on to it, I support. Braun needs to get his stuff together. He’s a great hitter obviously (who has some extra charisma for some here). But on the maturity side of things, he’s batting .240, in my book.
by heybatterbatter on Jul 6, 2009 12:14 PM CDT up reply actions
I think TSCC is saying that I have the anti Braun/Brewer bias….but watch out, if you make a contrary opinion more than once about Braun you will get labled.
I don't think I've been labeled
I’ve ripped Braun on numerous occasions.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, ""That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
Poor Choice.
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, ""That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
You haven't.
I don’t have a problem with those that criticize Braun. I’ve got a problem with those who dramatically predict that the team is about to implode every time Braun does something they don’t like, and then plays the martyr when someone calls them on their BS. You haven’t done any of those things, and thus I don’t hold you in the contempt I hold backtocali (who can fulfill the wish expressed in his user name any time now, as far as I’m concerned).
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 6, 2009 5:17 PM CDT up reply actions
Yes, it's your opinions about Braun that have been the main driving force in your wholly undeserved reputation here.
Snicker.
(Although I’m tempted to look up that fanpost on the other BCB again now…)
And so I did.
I have to say, the presumably unintended psychological insight offered by the “big chip on [his] shoulder for being undervalued and underappreciated” comment is just as funny the second time around.
by Zeyes on Jul 6, 2009 4:53 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Don't forget to mention how inaccurrate you've been in predicting the fall-out from Braun's actions.
If you want to whine about the way you’re perceived on this site instead of actually discussing the issue raised in the thread, you should at least acknowledge the entire basis for that perception. Even if it does get in the way of indulging your persecution complex.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 6, 2009 5:14 PM CDT up reply actions
This is getting eerily similar to Ol' Pete's last days..
Cards Announcers On Gamel's First Career HR, ""That’s all they need is another home run hitter".
Oh look...
… he went looking for a friendlier audience with his knee jerk, anti-Brewer/anti-Braun claptrap. Again.
http://www.vivaelbirdos.com/2009/7/6/939273/brewers-imploding
Only they think he’s full of crap too.
You know, I never had any desire to be a moderator on this or any other site, until now, just so I could have the pleasure of banning your weak stuff, even if KL would reinstate you for god only knows what reason a day later.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 6, 2009 8:32 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Can't Braun be a fan of the team and play on it too?
What else is he supposed to say when reporters ask him about how the team is playing? Say “Oh, I’m sorry, I can’t comment on that. I’m just the hired help/dumb jock and have no clue what needs to be done”? I’d rather have a team full of guys who know about the game and their teammates and have some intelligence than some idiots who just play baseball because they can, thanks.
"If lovin’ Braun is wrong, I want to be a repeat offender!"
RIP Nick Adenhart - Stop Drunk Driving
Did we all forget
Prince laying the smack on Manny for walking away after he had a bad game? I’d rather have Braun being vocal like he is then smacking the crap out of someone in the middle of the game, as far as distractions go. That’s nothing against Prince of course, both them are being honest and not hiding it
It's true, but I'm sure McClung and Burns didn't appriciate that
captainbok: What do you like the most about milwaukee
Jeff Suppan: Captain Bok, that is a great question. Does "Bok" mean Book of Knowledge? My favorite thing about Milwaukee are the Brewers.
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