Tuesday's Frosty Mug
by Kyle Lobner on Nov 30, 2010 9:02 AM CST
in Milwaukee Brewers News
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PrintSome things to read while going hard. (h/t @MKEBrewerGal)
It's hard to believe it's that time already, but Adam McCalvy has the first preview up for the Winter Meetings, which open in Orlando on Monday. As you might expect, the Brewers are still in the market for pitching.
And, once again, a reminder that the Brewers need the help: Dan Szymborski used the word "sub-cromulent" to describe his ZiPS projections for Brewer pitchers.
Saber By The Bay thinks the Brewers should change course and become active in the free agent market: They make the case for the Crew to sign Carl Pavano and Brandon Webb this winter.
It's probably safe to assume the winter meetings will feature a conversation or two on Prince Fielder: Doug Melvin told Tom Haudricourt he still doesn't know what he's going to do with the first baseman, and is still considering all options. Fielder was also a hot topic of conversation in Adam McCalvy's inbox.
Before the Brewers get to Orlando, though, there are a couple of roster deadlines coming up this week. Tom Haudricourt noted that Trevor Hoffman has until midnight tonight to decline the Brewers' offer of arbitration, and the team has until Thursday to decide whether or not to offer 2011 contracts to their arbitration-eligible players.
Meanwhile, Eric Hinske remains a possibility. The Appleton Post Crescent has a story on the Menasha native that says he's still weighing offers from the Brewers and Braves. (h/t David O'Brien)
Now that the managerial carousel has stopped spinning, Jon Heyman ranked teams' final decisions this week. He gave the Brewers a B- for hiring Ron Roenicke, and ranked them fifth of ten overall. (h/t Haudricourt)
Ryan Braun has been nominated for the 2010 This Year in Baseball Awards for Best Play. Follow this link to check out the video and vote for him.
Around baseball:
Dodgers: Have reportedly agreed to a three year, $21 million deal with infielder Juan Uribe.
Indians: Signed catcher Luke Carlin to a minor league deal.
Pirates: Infielder/outfielder Delwyn Young and infielder Andy LaRoche have cleared waivers and are now free agents.
Rangers: Signed catcher Yorvit Torrealba to a two year, $6.25 million deal.
Rockies: Are expected to sign Jorge De La Rosa to a three year, $30 million deal.
Tigers: Designated pitcher Zach Miner for assignment.
De La Rosa's new deal isn't the only transaction the Rockies will likely announce soon: They're reportedly close to a seven year contract extension with Troy Tulowitzki that would keep him in Denver through the 2021 season.
This week we've seen two relatively interesting starting pitchers, Jon Garland and Javier Vazquez, sign elsewhere. You could make a case that either of them would have been relatively interesting Brewers, but now that I've seen these red flags I'm not as sure: Memories of Kevin Malone notes some major health question marks with Garland, and Dave Cameron of FanGraphs has a post about Vazquez's sudden velocity drop.
Another day, another Rule 5 Draft preview: Prospect Insider has a look at ten pitchers and four position players that will be available when the draft is held next week.
Another winter pastime is starting to heat up: Hall of Fame ballots are out and this year's edition features three former Brewers up for consideration for the first time: Lenny Harris, Marquis Grissom and B.J. Surhoff.
Now that the ballots are out, the campaigning begins: Astros.com has a look at Jeff Bagwell's case.
Jamie Moyer rejects your definition of "too old." Jayson Stark reports that Moyer will undergo Tommy John surgery tomorrow, and hopes to pitch again in 2012, when he'll be 49 years old. It's probably a long shot, but if he manages to do it Moyer will likely have cemented his folk hero status.
If he implements a solid long toss routine, maybe he can pitch until he's 60. Doug Miller of MLB.com has a story on pitching coach Alan Jaeger, a proponent of the program. (h/t McCalvy)
Without the help of Flip Flop Fly Ball this information may have been lost until spring training, but with his help we now know where the button goes in the middle of the team and/or city name on every major league jersey.
Postseason shares were announced yesterday, so we now know that members of the Giants made $317,631.29 each for winning the World Series. All told, players from twelve teams received a share of the pot. The smallest payout went to the Cardinals, who earned $9,679.42 each. (h/t Cincinnati.com)
On this day in 1994, the Brewers acquired Fernando Vina from the Mets for reliever Doug Henry. Vina would go on to spend five seasons in Milwaukee and be a 1998 All Star.
Happy birthday today to:
- Helena Brewer Jose Oviedo, who turns 22.
- 2008 Brewer Ray Durham, who turns 39.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to keep warm.
Drink up.
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I wish Pavano would stay in Minnesota
only because his gimmick makes Twins games enjoyable every 5 days. Other than Liriano starts—because he’s actually, you know, good—it’s not a particular festival of enjoyment on the other 3 days. Looks like 2011 will involve lots of Blackburn, Slowey and Baker playing “who’s worst?”
Tulo
a contract for the next 10 years?? that is a big gamble for Colorado. I can see the 6-7 years, but to extend him 10 years until he is 36-37 y/o on an NL team… big gamble
by Saberilliterate on Nov 30, 2010 9:26 AM CST reply actions
I wish I could recall who said it
But someone on Twitter pointed out that the Rockies once extended Todd Helton for nine years.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
Would you say the same thing if it were being done for Braun?
I agree that a 10 year deal is very risky, but as Kyle mentions above, they did do it with Helton and it only looked like a bad deal for 2 maybe 3 of the 9 years, so thats a nice extension for both sides. And if I’m not mistaken, near the end of the deal Helton renegotiated so that the team could get some more salary room.
If you look at Baseball Prospectus’ projections 10 years out, they ahve Tulowitzki giving over 3 WAR out 9 years from now. If you factor in that he beat their estimates this year by 110%, a 10 year deal in the neighborhood of $218 million is probably fair.
For comparisions sake, Braun beat their number this year by 111% so if you push that out 10 years he would be due a 10 year
$182 contract. (They have him falling off a bit faster than with Tulowitzki and is a 2.8 WAR player 9 years out.)
I wouldnt mind seeing it for Braun
Nice to think of him in the lineup for the next 10 years
BCB: Pointless Exercises in Devils Advocacy
True
Helton made his contract worthwhile, and only in 2 years was he not worth his salary according to Fangraphs. That involved a lot of luck in keeping him heathly.
The issue though is that LF is more physically demanding than 1B. So the chance of Braun having an injury is comparably greater.
That being said, Braun is cheap compared to his production all the way to the end of the current deal. Extending him another 3-5 years is not a bad idea as long as it stays within the relative framework of his current deal.
In regards to Tulo, there’s a lot more risk, especially with the physicals demands of the SS position. His ’08 can attest to that.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Tulo was already under contract until 2014
Question is no longer “is Tulo worth $20MM a year,” because he might be today, but rather “Will he be worth $20MM a year in 2015?” That’s why I don’t completely understand this, but that’s just me.
Like a lot of deals though
Its back end loaded, so that the player is underpaid in the beginning and over paid near the end.
Also as with Arb eligible players vs Free Agents. You get underpaid the first 6 years if you are a big time guy, but get rewarded for past performance with an overpaying contract for the future.
I haven't seen it yet, but I'd assume the deal has a hefty no-trade clause?
Now that's great tasting chicken!
by Kyle Lobner on Nov 30, 2010 11:09 AM CST up reply actions
Probably a good bet
He is from Southern California and if like most guys in that spot when the NT is excercised, its either to a contender or close to home. I assume that is what it would look like if Braun had one in his contract….“send me to the Dodgers or Angels or a contender…”
All of the details will probably be out soon enough.
You also have to take into account how much he outperforms his contract
for example, according to Fangraphs, Braun has been worth 59.4 million over the first 3 years of his deal, while being paid 2.2 Million. That performance is worth more than the entire contract, and unless he bottoms out or plays as he did his worst season (last year), he’s still underpaid through the life of the deal.
Now, expecting a 4 win season when he’s 37 may be a bit of a stretch. But it is doable. I would be ok with locking him up to 35, so an additional 3 year extention is ok by me.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Just Because
Just because he was worth $60M over 3 years doesn’t mean the team could have afforded to pay him that much now or in 8 years.
by Saberilliterate on Nov 30, 2010 12:54 PM CST up reply actions
good point
but considering he’s not Hank Blalock, and at his worst has been a 4 win player, I’m pretty confident in his ability to exceed the value of his contract in just about any year.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Tulo Contract Details
Same deal through 2013, 16M in ‘14, 20M for ’15-’19, 14M base in 20, but there are built in escalators for 6M for 20, as well as a team option for 14M with escalators that could take it to 20M for ’21. all in all, its total value is 163M.
As a side note, he’ll be earning 20M from the ages of 30-35, 14M for age 36 with escalators that could take it to 20M, and the team option is 14M with escalators for age 37. I’m willing to put that 20M up in a bet that the team will not exercize a 20M option on a 37 year old SS.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
you've made derek jeter very sad
old shortstops are worth even more than that!
by Capt Science on Nov 30, 2010 3:34 PM CST up reply actions
HOF
Really – Lenny Harris, Marquis Grissom and B.J. Surhoff are on the ballot…. I don’t see how any of them even deserve to be on the ballot
by Saberilliterate on Nov 30, 2010 9:27 AM CST reply actions
I think it's automatic after x number of years playing the game
by PagsBrewCrew on Nov 30, 2010 9:52 AM CST up reply actions
Actually I think they have a committee that selects the ballot
I read it in Bill James’ What Ever Happened to the Hall of Fame?"
you sure thats not the NFL?
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
wait
you are talking about the Veterans committee. They also have a 3 different Eras committees and rules for all 3, including Pre-Integration (before 1947), Golden(1947-1972), and expansion (1973 and beyond)
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
I am ON FIRE!!! with this HOF info
that’s what happens when you throw in my wheelhouse, and I just got NBA Jam for my WII
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
WHOA
NBA Jam for the wii? how is that?!?!?
by Capt Science on Nov 30, 2010 3:35 PM CST up reply actions
pretty sweet
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
They played in 10 MLB seasons
thats how.
http://baseballhall.org/hall-famers/rules-election/bbwaa
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
so using "sub-cromulent" is appropriate
I think, I still haven’t looked it up.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
But how's NBA Jam going?
I’m about halfway through as the Bucks. I’ve lost to the Heat a couple of times in a row and that’s deflated some of my enthusiasm.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
by Kyle Lobner on Nov 30, 2010 10:24 AM CST up reply actions
I just started with the bucks on easy
I’m just getting adjusted to the WII classic control, but I am really enjoying it. I do miss the random power ups you pick up off the floor though. That was a sweet addition to the sequal to the origial it that they booted for this one. But I love it. My favorite announcer line is, “Hey man, you shot blocked me.”
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
I found the classic controller to be very non-intuitive.
If they’d kept the controls from the original games, then the classic controller would be my weapon of choice. Instead, I’ve gotten used to using the Wiimote and the nunchuk.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
by Kyle Lobner on Nov 30, 2010 11:11 AM CST up reply actions
me having the energy to play with the wiimote and nunchuck
is completely comprimised by having a 6 month old. You wouldn’t believe how exhausting it is to chase after a new crawler.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
If lifting your arm and lowering it again is that strenuous
Then maybe you should put NBA Jam down and see if you can catch a nap.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
by Kyle Lobner on Nov 30, 2010 11:15 AM CST up reply actions
sage advise.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
my left arm is getting pretty swoll
that’s the cradle arm so I can use the mouse or drink some water with my right hand.
by PagsBrewCrew on Nov 30, 2010 12:51 PM CST up reply actions
it'll embiggen you to look that up
also, enjoy your neogasm.
by PagsBrewCrew on Nov 30, 2010 12:49 PM CST up reply actions
Always interesting
ZiPS apparently still isn’t a Casey McGehee believer. It projects Gamel’s OPS+ higher.
Speaking of Gamel, was it yesterday’s mug that dealt with the Brewers apparently being interested in moving Gamel for pitching? Is Dougie serious? Does his business card read:
Doug Melvin
Always Behind the Curve
Milwaukee Brewers
?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 11:33 AM CST up reply actions
I would much rather keep Gamel as well
to replace Hart, McGehee or Fielder, but he does still have some value. Albeit nowhere near as much as he had last year at this time.
I would approximate Gamel’s Surplus at about $6 million. So if you were going to try and flip him for a pitcher, that means a vet with moderately expensive contract the remaining year or two, no comp draft picks, where the player is maybe giving you 2.5 WAR while with the Brewers. Definitely an upgrade from what they have on hand now, but not enough to justify 6 years of a promising player (bat) for a 2 year shot at the playoffs and that guy you get doesnt really get you there by himself.
Come one now
He could get some really crappy pitching for Gamel that would fit right into our current rotation.
For your health!
Yo for 159 innings? :/
I would think it should be at least around 185 innings
by ilikeburritos on Dec 1, 2010 8:47 AM CST up reply actions
Most projections will be low on playing time for a guy who's almost certainly a full time player.
I don’t know exactly how ZiPS work, but I’d guess they’re based on an average of several simulations, probably including one where injuries derail him.
The fact that he only pitched 24 innings in 2008 probably doesn’t help either. Right now, his simple weighted average (50% 2010, 30% 2009 and 20% 2008) is 153 innings.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
Postseason shares
I want to know who takes the lead in the player meetings and nominates 0.01 or 0.05 partial shares like the Reds and Cardinals gave. I like thinking there are players that particular around the league.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
Wouldn't "cash award" make more sense at 0.05 partial share?
Nice to see that they all tend to spread the wealth around a little, though. It probably helps that it’s getting close to Christmas when everyone feels a little more generous.
Minecraft is like digital Legos. I like digital things and I like Legos. I am now addicted to Minecraft.
I was wondering about that
I guess they just appreciate the hard work the crews put in. Even a 0.1 share adds up to $30,000 for the World Series champs. Not a bad bonus.
Minecraft is like digital Legos. I like digital things and I like Legos. I am now addicted to Minecraft.
Yeah, though I suppose shares might be for on the field guys while cash awards might be clubhouse personnel, etc.
It’s probably a bunch of weird percentages that happened to sum to 1.05, like 30+50+25, but my point still holds. Maybe they had someone who was only around for a week and gave them a pro-rated share.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
Rockies: Good and Bad in one day
Good: extending Troy Tulowitzki
Bad: Signing Jorge De La Rosa to a 3 year deal in excess of $10M per.
What’s with the Jekyll/Hyde?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 11:28 AM CST reply actions
3 years/ 30 mil!
I’m glad I’m not a Rockies fan.
My goodness.
by BrewHaHeather on Nov 30, 2010 11:44 AM CST up reply actions
Some may say Bad/Bad...
Twitterize me: @mykenk
by Mykenk on Nov 30, 2010 12:31 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
10 years is a little ridiculous
but Tulowitzki is probably the best SS in baseball, when you account for the high quality of his glove, and his offensive production.
So, while someone would say extending him is bad, they would be wrong.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 2:21 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
The 10 year deal worked for Jeter.
If the Rockies get lucky it could turn out fine.
For your health!
Lucky?
Tulowitzki is already a better SS than Jeter ever was. How would they have to get lucky?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 3:09 PM CST up reply actions
Tulo to Stay Healthy
There is no doubt that he is worth that money right now. The luck comes into play in whether his production will still be worth close to that in years 7-10 and that he hasn’t had a catastrophic career ending injury or something that forces him to be a DH/1B. Especially since so much of his value is the premium defensive position.
by Saberilliterate on Nov 30, 2010 3:29 PM CST up reply actions
Isn't this the danger for EVERY player?
Sorry, its an assumed risk for any player signing any contract. I can’t actually believe this is THE reason people are going to use to say “this contract is bad!!1”
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 6:03 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
It's 10 years. That's the only issue with it.
There are so many things that can happen to a player in 10 years.
He could have a serious injury in the first year and be worthless for the remaining 9 years of his contract.
Also, there is just sometimes unexpected regression. look at the contract the Cubs gave Soriano. 8 years…. 136 million dollars and they just simply didn’t get the player that they thought they were signing.
He can’t run anymore, his power numbers are down, they just simply aren’t getting what they thought they were when they signed him.
I think the contract is fine if TT stays healthy and he performs. I don’t really understand WHY they gave him this contract though, especially right now. He was already under contract.
For your health!
So say the issue is the contract length, then
NOT “he could get injured”.
I understand if people take issue with the length. But don’t use an already assumed condition as the ‘reason’ its a bad contract.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Dec 1, 2010 12:23 PM CST up reply actions
Well, now he's got ten years to develop chronic knee, back or shoulder issues.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
I guess, if you're cynical.
While its possible the contract blows up in their face, the Rockies are paying one of the top 5 or 6 defensive SS in the game, who just so happens to also be quite good at offense at a defense-first position.
I’m sure he’s moving to 3B at some point down the road, but I’m more comfortable with his value remaining high than I am with, say, Mark Teixeira’s.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 3:45 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Tulowitzki is going to be earning $20 million per in his age 35, 36 and 37 seasons.
A 4+ WAR season by a 35+ year old shortstop or third baseman has only happened 16 times in the expansion era, and no player has done it more than twice:
Chipper Jones 2
Mike Schmidt 2
Ozzie Smith 2
Wade Boggs 2
Alan Trammell 1
Barry Larkin 1
Brooks Robinson 1
Casey Blake 1
Derek Jeter 1
Luis Aparicio 1
Pete Rose 1
Tony Phillips 1
So, unless Tulowitzki is entering uncharted territory, the top of the upside for this contract includes a few heavily overpaid seasons at the end. If he plateaus and declines earlier than that, the last few years of this deal are going to be comparable to Albert Belle’s, when the Orioles were still paying him as he neared Hall of Fame eligibility.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
He only needs to average 3.6 WAR over the "new money" portion of the contract
From the projections that Ive seen, he is expected to do that, in essence giving the Rockies a tremendous discount on the contract.
Heck, he’s already earned $80.1 million with his overall performance, while only being paid $7.9 million (and that number includes his draft signing bonus).
Expanding my list above from guys with 4+ WAR to guys with 3.6+ WAR doesn't add much
Six more seasons. One each for Rolen, Boggs, Aparicio, Maury Wills, Ed Charles and Phil Garner. 22 total.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
But, interestingly enough, there were only 3 SS in all of MLB that put up better than 4.0 WAR
Tulowitzki: 6.4
Stepehn Drew: 5.1
Hanley Ramirez: 4.4
So, your requirement is that he has to put up elite numbers for 10 years to make the contract worth it? I suppose I disagree if that’s the case.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 4:41 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
If the team is paying him $20 million per
Then yes, I’d say elite numbers are the expectation.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
Really? For every single year? What about an average?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Dec 1, 2010 12:24 PM CST up reply actions
Well, of course
If you take a set of ten years you’ll likely get at least one partial season, a down year, and some decline.
But for the Rockies to even break even on this deal, he’d need to average a very good-to-great season over ten years, all the way through age 37. That’s possible, but even if it happens there will likely be years at the end where they’re paying for past performance, not current. There’s likely going to be a stretch at the end of this deal where he’s owed $60-80 million despite the fact that he wouldn’t be worth that on the market.
For them to come out signficantly ahead on this deal, he’d have to perform so well and so consistently that he’d be a near lock for the Hall of Fame. There’s an above-average chance he will, but it’s nowhere near a lock.
Consider, for example, Nomar Garciaparra. Through age 25 he had numbers similar to Tulo’s. But if you’d bought his next ten seasons at that point, you’d have been paying him for a long time after he was done as a productive regular at 29.
The upside of locking Tulo up for ten seasons is very high, and I’ll fully acknowledge that. But I think it’s foolish not to note that the floor here is “worst contract in baseball.”
Now that's great tasting chicken!
Well said
I’m assuming you’re saying the floor would be the worst CURRENT contract in baseball since he would have to basically turn into a completely useless player for his contract status to eclipse horrible signings like Mike Hampton.
For your health!
Agreed
although I don’t think anyone can top Barry Zito for ‘worst contract in baseball’.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Dec 1, 2010 5:44 PM CST up reply actions
The Cubs have a few in the running
but I would say yeah…
Zito’s got to be the worst.
For your health!
So, like Trevor Hoffman last year?
I’m fully aware of all of this. I simply don’t think that with the way baseball contracts are structured it makes this a “bad deal”.
The Rockies may have felt the need to overpay in order to keep Tulowitzki in Denver. If they did that by giving him 2 extra years, and they understand the possibilities, then who cares?
Its really, really easy to peg something as a “bad deal” before hand, because its a lot easier to say “oh, well I thought it was bad, and it still might be, but so far its been good” than it is to say “yeah, I thought it was a good idea, and its turning out like shit”.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 4:39 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
I think you also have to look at the fact that $20 million might not be as big of a deal in 10 years
I would guess that with the economy recovering contracts will go back to growing like they were before.
Now dont get my wrong I am not saying in 10 years 20 mil will be a drop in the bucket, just that you cant really look at it in comparison to the market of 2010.
BCB: Pointless Exercises in Devils Advocacy
by Jeo on Nov 30, 2010 4:51 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
it doesn't matter
the solar system will end in 2012. making people happy in the next two years with promises with what’s to be in 2020 is just gravy
:P
by PagsBrewCrew on Nov 30, 2010 8:03 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
So
what your saying is we should be offering Cliff Lee a contract in the area of, 2011 – 5 Mil/ 2012 – 6 mil/ 2013 – 50 mil/ 2014 100 mil/ 2015 option 200 mil
BCB: Pointless Exercises in Devils Advocacy
by Jeo on Dec 1, 2010 8:46 AM CST up reply actions
If you assume the apocalypse is coming, then your math is about right.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
I miss cheating like that in poorly designed franchise modes
Sign decent guys to contracts with huge options that aren’t factored into trade value and cripple other teams through trades.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
Right, I should have clarified:
Tulowitzki is already a significantly better defensive shortstop than Derek Jeter ever was. He’s also go the offensive upside to give him more value than Jeter has had.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 3:38 PM CST up reply actions
I am SOOOOOO glad they did that though!
He was one of my biggest fears. Seemed like a match made in heaven, the kind of guy DM goes out of his way to get. A former Brewer who has really good stuff nut isn’t actually a very good pitcher.
What’s weird about him is he’s actually better in Coors field than he is on the road. He’s not great at either but it’s still kind of weird.
For your health!
Yeah, there aren't any good pitchers available this fall
might as well progress with what we’ve got.
Twitterize me: @mykenk
It is a pretty damn lackluster market
Here’s hoping DM pulls off some miracle trade but what are the chances of that when it involves pitching.
For your health!
I really want the Brewers to select Clay Zavada in the Rule 5 draft.
Could you imagine him and Axford coming out of the bullpen?
It would be glorious.
by Noah Jarosh on Nov 30, 2010 11:39 AM CST reply actions 4 recs
I suppose, if you're not gonna try to compete, might as well be as gimmicky as possible.
Twitterize me: @mykenk
by Mykenk on Nov 30, 2010 12:31 PM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Pretty sure that's what DM does every year.
He’s just not very good at being gimmicky.
Probably part of that whole Canadian thing.
For your health!
nationalist
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
thats what I'm here for.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
Do you think they should 'try to compete'?
If so, how?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 2:22 PM CST up reply actions
No, I don't think they should try to compete.
Well, I think they should always try, but the necessary pieces aren’t available. Signing guys for the sake of the mustache is one way to prove you don’t care.
Twitterize me: @mykenk
Got it
wasn’t clear on what your contention was, mostly because you seem to sarcastically say “yeah, we’re going for it in 2017”, and I always thought that was a jab at people who thought that 2011 should be a ‘rebuildish’ year, and 2012 should be the year they try for a run. But then I wasn’t sure if your above statement was sarcastic or not. So I didn’t know where you were coming from.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Nov 30, 2010 4:43 PM CST up reply actions
they don't need to waste a Rule 5 pick
Zavada is, the last time I checked, a free agent. Arizona is negotiating with him to bring him back but as far as I know, he hasn’t signed yet. This could be the time! (Also, I had thought DM had wanted every minor-league LHP he could find in the organization. Or it just seems that way.)
Minor league LHP and knuckleballers
The staff in Nashville should be Charlie Zink and 11 lefties.
I never use a big word when a diminutive word would suffice.
I think it's DM's dream
to have an entire rotation full of low potential / under-performing left handed pitchers.
If it weren’t for that pesky Gallardo guy he’d be pretty close to achieving his dream.
For your health!
Unlike the past couple of seasons
I think there are a couple of Rule 5 guys out there worth taking a pick for: Kasey Kiker LHP Texas and Wynn Pelzer RHP Baltimore.
Both players were on their teams top 10 prospect lists last year, both throw hard, have big k/9 numbers, plus fastballs, ability to start. And althought niether are probably ready for a mlb rotation right now, would be nice pick ups for a 5 year plan sort of thing. I would say Pelzer profiles as either a #4 or back of the bullpen arm, and Kiker a #3 with upside or 8th inning/closer potential.
oh, I don't believe the Rule 5 is a waste
just that I wouldn’t have blown that pick on Zavada—he had TJ surgery in April ’10.
After further thought, and looking at the mustachioed gentlemen again.
I should have changed “It would be glorious” to “It would be diabolical”.
that Japanese guy gets mine
not the MLB? I don’t care
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYdpBNonxA4
by PagsBrewCrew on Nov 30, 2010 8:06 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
awsome
one of the best plays I have ever seen, the brewers should sign him
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NL Central Standings
| W | L | PCT | GB | STRK | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Cincinnati
|
25 | 19 | .568 | 0 | Won 6 |
|
St. Louis
|
25 | 20 | .555 | 0.5 | Lost 1 |
|
Houston
|
21 | 23 | .477 | 4 | Won 3 |
|
Pittsburgh
|
20 | 24 | .454 | 5 | Lost 2 |
|
Milwaukee
|
18 | 26 | .409 | 7 | Won 1 |
|
Chicago
|
15 | 29 | .340 | 10 | Lost 9 |
(updated 5.25.2012 at 3:41 AM CDT)
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