Tuesday's Frosty Mug
by Kyle Lobner on Mar 16, 2010 9:11 AM CDT
in News
90 comments
Some things to read while choosing a new seat.
The Brewers will take on the Royals later today, and Chris Narveson will get the start against Gil Meche. Today is also Randy Wolf's day to pitch, but he'll pitch in a camp game with minor leaguers instead, avoiding the road trip and giving the team another chance to evaluate Narveson.
Kevin Kaduk of Yahoo was in Brewer camp yesterday, and has a profile of Prince Fielder. The premise ("What's it like to be in camp coming off a good season?") is interesting, but this quote buried near the bottom is what caught my attention:
One thing Fielder can count on is a lot of money in his future, whether it's through working out a deal to remain a Brewer or on the open market in 2012. But he told me that the early camp stories about a contract extension with Milwaukee won't continue into the season.
"If it is, they're going to talk to Scott [Boras]," Fielder said. "I'm done talking about it. Like I said, I'm here for two years. If I'm not here, it's not my fault."
Meanwhile, it remains a quiet spring for Trevor Hoffman, who is slowly working his way towards pitching in games. The All Time Saves Leader pitched live BP yesterday (Adam McCalvy has a picture) and is expected to pitch in his first Cactus League game on Friday.
Can we just go ahead and name Yovani Gallardo the Opening Day starter already? Gallardo is lined up to pitch that day and is the clear frontrunner for the job, but Ken Macha won't confirm it.
The Brewers also trimmed four players from camp yesterday, optioning Mark Rogers and Amaury Rivas to Huntsville and returning pitcher A.J. Murray and catcher Martin Maldonado to minor league camp (FanShot).
Other minutiae from camp:
- Todd Coffey says his arm feels great after his heavy workload last season, and credits some shoulder exercises he learned from Trevor Hoffman.
- The Jackson Sun has a hometown profile of Casey McGehee, and a look at his offseason work.
- If you weren't listening to Sunday's game, you missed Bob Uecker and Bob Costas in all their glory. Cory Provus has a review. If you were attempting to listen to Sunday's game during the Uecker/Costas segment, you likely missed the game.
- Wisconsin Sports Tap has today's updates on the position battles in camp, and predicts that one of the two of Dave Bush and Jeff Suppan won't be on the Opening Day roster.
If you've been around the internet this week, you've probably heard nearly every detail of a "rumored to have been discussed" trade involving Albert Pujols and Ryan Howard. That got Joe Pawlikowski of FanGraphs thinking about same position one-for-one swaps that could actually happen and might make sense. He proposes a deal that would send Prince Fielder to the Angels for Kendry Morales.
It remains to be seen if Randy Wolf and Doug Davis will be able to stabilize the Brewer starting rotation, but at the very least they should be able to stabilize the running game: David Pinto of Baseball Musings took a look at pitchers as part of his Probabilistic Model of Steals, and noted that Wolf and Davis are among the top ten pitchers since 1996 at preventing opposing baserunners from trying to steal.
Could a change in Manny Parra's luck (or the defense behind him) be all it takes to turn him around? This ESPN article is insider-only but the first few paragraphs are free, and they note that batters have a lifetime .349 BABIP against Parra, the highest against any pitcher since 1900.
Wezen-ball took on an interesting project this week: paging through three pre-season guides to see which players are featured as the stars of each team. Not surprisingly, the Brewer results came back Braun and Fielder with a side of Gallardo.
It's not confirmed yet, but there's a decent chance this is the real LaTroy Hawkins on Twitter. If it is Hawkins, follow the link for some questionable spelling and a homophobic slur.
In projections, rankings and other miscellany:
- The B-Ref Blog has the 2010 Marcel projected standings for the NL Central, and much more. They project the Brewers for 82 wins, and also have individual projections for nearly every likely contributor.
- Red Reporter has a Brewer preview and predicted they'll win 78 games.
- Baseball Digest Daily has a 2010 Brewer preview.
- Big League Stew also has five questions about the Brewers, covering Fielder, Wolf, Gallardo, Corey Hart and Casey McGehee.
- All Down The Line is a new baseball travel blog run by Caryn of MetsGrrl, and she started off with a ranking of the 14 parks she's visited to date. Miller Park ranks 11th of the 14, and fifth of six in the NL Central.
Around baseball:
Athletics: Returned Rule 5 selection Bobby Cassevah to the Angels.
Diamondbacks: Signed Mark Reynolds to a three year, $14.5 million deal, buying out two years of arbitration with an option for his third arb year. They also signed Kris Benson to a minor league deal.
Dodgers: Returned Rule 5 pick Armando Zerpa to Boston, and assigned Eric Gagne to minor league camp.
Nationals: Released pitcher Ron Villone.
By now, you've probably heard about Ben Sheets' performance yesterday, where he allowed all ten batters he faced to reach in the first inning against the Reds. It's only a spring training game, but Kevin Kaduk of Big League Stew says a meltdown on that scale from a pitcher who missed all of last season is too big to be written off.
This might be a news story every day until they finally win: The Nationals are 0-11 this spring, and as Jayson Stark notes, three teams (including the Brewers) didn't lose 11 times all spring in 2009.
Today's spring training slices of life have an "overcoming poverty" theme:
- Jeff Passan of Yahoo has the story of Rockies pitcher Ubaldo Jimenez, one of the rare Dominican players to graduate from high school.
- Tim Brown, also of Yahoo, has the story of Padres shortstop Everth Cabrera, who grew up in Nicaragua.
- Finally, Fernando Perez of the Rays discusses the challenges and hardships faced by major leaguers forced to play for the league minimum.
FanGraphs has started their 2010 organization rankings, and it's not a proud moment for fans of the NL Central: The Astros checked in dead last, behind the Royals.
Happy birthday today to 2008 Nashville Sound Abraham Nunez, who turns 34.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm out of detergent.
Drink up.
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I think THwitter retweeted Hawkins' "slur" as "you (smoke)"
Don’t think there’s only one definition for that word. Check the dictionary.
Also, Suppan wasn’t officially confirmed as the Opening Day starter until April last year so it could be a while yet for Gallardo.
If Villone signs somewhere new and makes an appearance in the majors, it will be his 13th different team, a record. He is currently tied with Mike Morgan. Unfortunately he’s already hit many of the currently bad teams.
Failure is just success rounded down.
Don’t think there’s only one definition for that word. Check the dictionary.
Semantics aside, there’s one likely use for that word.
That's all I've got for you today, unless you're interested in some Chris Capuano/Tom Haudricourt Fan Fiction.
by Kyle Lobner on Mar 16, 2010 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
Villone --
Along those lines — If Matt Stairs breaks camp with the Pads, he will be the first position player to play for 12 teams. If he hits a HR, it will be for an 11th team, which is a record, and I think Stairs is one PH HR away from tying Cliff Johnson’s career record of 19.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Let's not be too harsh on The Hawk
Perhaps he was calling someone a bundle of sticks or twigs, he’s British and called someone a cigarette, or he’s into needlework.
When there is a scuffle in Ireland, there’s no need to specifically mention in the news story that alcohol was involved
The cigarette thing calls to mind my favorite quote in the history of Arrested Development.
But I shall hold my tongue unless I get the OK.
Well, that gets me wondering
I wonder how many runs are prevented by a LHP solely due to the greater difficulty in stealing second off of one (and not things like innate ability or opposing batter splits).
"I will agree that the attitude [at BCB] is ridiculous and they have done so much to instigate animosity and then block us from responding. Real mature!"
Probably not much
since steals have a very minimal added value. If a team is dumb enough to try stealing and makes outs I guess it could be pretty big though.
Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.
I don't thinki Parra will benifit from better defense.
Why is it assumed that Escobar will step in and make our defense instantly better. Hardy wasn’t exactly a bad or even average defender. He was above average and by a good amount. Escobar will have to come in and be elite to be better than Hardy. Until he gains some consistency I think it is questionable that Escobar will be a better defender than Hardy. Add in that Weeks will not match the defense we got at 2B last year(+14 runs by UZR, best in the majors) and I completely disagree that better defense will help Parra. Our defense may not even be as good this year as it was in 2009.
Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.
Right
A couple of things…
1.) Parra’s DIPS ERA for 2009 was higher than his Normalized Runs, which is an indication that his Defense actually helped him out last year. I think when we discuss other things, we generally conclude that the Brewers D in 2009 was as good as it has ever been — why all of a sudden it was “bad” for Parra doesn’t seem to hold water – at least to the degree where it moved Parra’s ERA towards ~6.50.
2.) Fangraphs did a piece this winter on Parra, and they concluded that he left his fastball over the plate a lot more than MLB pitchers typically do, and furthermore Parra’s fastball got crushed when he left it over the plate.
Certainly there is probably some luck factor, but Parra’s BABIP has always been high, and he consistently underperforms his FIP — I think that the answer may be that Parra just isn’t hitting his spots, and his pitch is not moving at all, and MLB hitters are lighting him up.
Parra has been hurt, and I know he has changed his armslot somewhat — I think that may have compromised his effectiveness — of course that is my guess — I think though there is a lot more happening than “bad D” or “luck”.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't disagree
But I think “bad D” and “luck” could both be factors. And while elements of the defense were better than ever last year, there were some notable holes:
1) Casey McGehee spent most of the second half playing third on a bad knee.
2) Braun and Hart both demonstrate somewhat poor range, at least as rated by UZR.
Now, I’m not saying defense and luck are the only factors. But there’s reason to believe he was unlucky on top of being bad last season.
That's all I've got for you today, unless you're interested in some Chris Capuano/Tom Haudricourt Fan Fiction.
by Kyle Lobner on Mar 16, 2010 10:08 AM CDT up reply actions
Bad/Good D and Luck
Are always going to be factors — what bothers me is that it has become the de facto reason for variations in pitchers performance, and people are accepting such large variances readily.
As I mentioned above if a pitcher’s DERA is higher than his NRA — then it is generally accepted that his defense actually helped him out — which is the case for 2009 Parra.
In the award winning Suppan thread — there were comparisons made to Parra and Suppan, and claims that Parra pitched better, however, had worse results – ignoring the fact that Suppan and Parra pitch in front of the same defense. Certainly there could be variations (even for teammate pitchers) but not to the point where it drives Parra’s ERA an entire run over Suppan’s.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 10:19 AM CDT up reply actions
To be fair to Parra
Macha tacked on 0.25 ERA by leaving him in one game against the Marlins(a little more actually but I am to lazy to do the math right now). Parra had to “take one for the team.” Parra was also at least a little unlucky. I am not saying he pitched better than Suppan in 2009, but I would expect Parra to pitch better than Suppan going forward.
I think our defense in 2009 was a little above average. We were better on defense in 2008 than in 2009.
Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.
Parra's ERA wold have been6.04
if he had been removed in the Marlins game. 0.32 for one time taking one for the team. Not a big difference but it shows how much even a few bad starts can affect ERA and why ERA is so volatile year to year.
Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.
couple of things...
1.) I readily concede, that luck/defense affected Parra in 2009 — however not to the degree that explains why he has an ERA almost ~6.5.
2.) I don’t think our defense will be better in 2010, certainly not to the point where Parra’s ERA will get back around the 4.25 mark. I think that if Parra is going to garner better results, it’s going to have to come from better pitching.
3.) I certainly agree that Suppan sucks, and I think Parra “should” be better than Suppan in 2010, however, I am not ready to bet the company payroll on it just yet.
In all of this — really the major point I am trying to make, is that while Suppan is terrible, the reality is, we don’t have a whole lot of options to replace him for 2010.
We had 9 starters last year — I suspect this year we will need at least 6-7 to get through the year — probably more like 8-9.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 11:14 AM CDT up reply actions
I agree with most of that.
1) I agree. He was a little unlucky but he got hit hard for a reason.
2) I think our defense might even be worse in 2010 than 2009
3 )I wouldn’t bet on it either. I think we have a pretty good idea that Suppan will be in a 5.00-5.50 range for ERA. Parra somewhere between 4.25-5.50. Parra’s problems are fixable(location/control/BB rate) Suppan’s(velocity/age) are not. I would put Bush and Parra in the rotation because I think their upside is way better than Suppan and their downside only a little worse.
I have been posting that I think we need to keep Suppan because our other options are at best unknowns at worst suck all offseason so I agree with you again there.
Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.
Yep
And Halama getting released and Cappy getting shut down, doesn’t help the argument to DFA Suppan.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 11:44 AM CDT up reply actions
for?
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions
Replacing Suppan in the rotation so they can DFA him.
Not saying it’s likely to happen… just saying those are probably the only two options left.
Well --
As we have been saying, Parra isn’t a lock — I am not sure Narveson will be very good — and after those 2 there isn’t much depth at AAA.
In reality — we are going to need 6-8 starters at least to get through the season. I don’t see a good reason to DFA Suppan unless it really gets bad once the season begins.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 12:59 PM CDT up reply actions
"I don't see a good reason to DFA Suppan unless it really gets bad once the season begins."
If you’re right, and you probably are, that might be the most damning indictment of Melvin I’ve seen since he took over as GM.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed.
I am way past getting mad about the stupid $14M contract we have with Suppan — I am pissed that we don’t have a guy in AAA that is a good bet to suck less.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions
Agreed.
The question is whether or not the Brewers are willing to keep Bush as a non-starter.
Not sure if having Narveson as the only legitmate backup plan for Suppan is such a good idea.
I don't see any reason to dump Bush
Unless DM thinks we are a 75 win team.
Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog
by Fatter than Joey on Mar 16, 2010 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions
The only reason to drop Bush is to save around 3.5MM this year
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Mar 16, 2010 1:28 PM CDT up reply actions
Just to clarify
What is your DIPS ERA exactly, and where is it from?
E: George 4 (5, throw, throw, throw, throw).
Whoever is behind the Hawkins twitter
appears to be a fan of Kansas basketball. Hawkins is from Indiana and didn’t go to college, FWIW.
by richardhkirkando on Mar 16, 2010 10:08 AM CDT reply actions
Hmm…his nephew actually plays for the Jayhawks. There we go.
by richardhkirkando on Mar 16, 2010 10:11 AM CDT up reply actions
If this has already been posted, apologies
But this is an interesting read. It may come as a shock to some that Phil Garner apparently has no concept either.
When there is a scuffle in Ireland, there’s no need to specifically mention in the news story that alcohol was involved
by Getting Yosted on Mar 16, 2010 10:12 AM CDT reply actions 1 recs
I said it years ago
but Yost may have been the best manager in the NL Central. Of course Cooper, LaRussa(over manages), Baker, Pinella, and whomever the Pirates manager was are not much competition. I think it is more of an indictment on managers in general.
Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.
Lofgren to AAA
Brewers trade RHP Omar Aguilar to Cleveland to keep Rule 5 LHP Chuck Lofgren and send to AAA Nashville.
I'm ambivalent.
And sort of enjoying it. It doesn’t happen all that often.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 10:51 AM CDT up reply actions
Which part?
So if I understand, the Brewers just made an outright trade of Aguilar for Lofgren? Does Rule 5 allow that or did Lofgren technical revert back to the Indians control for 30 minutes before becoming a Brewer gain?
Most importantly, do the Brewers get their $50,000 back? ;-)
Pretty sure there's a trade like every couple of years.
If I understand things correctly, the Indians would have had to keep Lofgren on their roster if they took him back, and they apparently weren’t excited about him taking up a roster spot. This way both teams get someone they’re interested in and the flexibility to send their respective players to the minors.
Hopefully the Jay will correct me if I’m wrong on the rule.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 11:03 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't know
The guys returned by Oakland to LAna and LA to Boston aren’t on any 40-man roster. I think they get returned to their former team’s AAA club.
Probably the best way to view the trade is the Indians decided Aguilar was of more use to them than Lofgren and the $25k it would cost to get Lofgren back.
Failure is just success rounded down.
Or
The Brewers traded Aguilar to the Indians for “future considerations,” which the Indians then used to justify not asking for Lofgren back.
That's all I've got for you today, unless you're interested in some Chris Capuano/Tom Haudricourt Fan Fiction.
by Kyle Lobner on Mar 16, 2010 11:54 AM CDT up reply actions
My mistake...
… it didn’t really sound right in my own head as I typed it. I probably misinterpreted someone else’s description of how the rule works.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions
Appropo of nothing...
… Ben Sheets gave up 10 runs and didn’t record an out in his last start for the A’s. He then said he thought it was a better performance than his last start.
It’s spring training, so it doesn’t mean anything. But I miss quotes like that from Sheets. It’s not that often that a guy can give up 10 runs, not get an out, claim to have improved since his last start and I believe the guy when he says it. I don’t miss fearing his next DL stint and wondering what he could accomplish if he managed to stay healthy, but I won’t forget him shredding his arm for the team in 2008.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 10:58 AM CDT reply actions
Sheets ALWAYS looks like shit in spring
if I remember right.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Mar 16, 2010 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions
Yes, but
has he ever been rocked that hard before in the bigs?
I know that sometimes “stuff just happens,” but I guess it would be easier for me to chalk it up to “stuff happens” if Ben hadn’t been hurt and out of competition for a year-plus.
You've got a couple screws missin' up in your toolbox, if you think that you'll stop this man from hittin' moonshots.
True
And while I’m not irrationally wishing him ill as I do for Brett Favre, I won’t be particularly disappointed if he never pitches like he did in Milwaukee.
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Mar 16, 2010 9:31 PM CDT up reply actions
Spring training is the best.
I can’t imagine a quarterback going 0-18, throwing 4 picks, and getting sacked six times in an exhibition game and saying: “I thought I played OK.”
Per McCalvy - Halama will pitch with his feet on a different team this year
Busy Tuesday morning for the #Brewers, who also released LHP John Halama. He was a nonroster invitee. http://bit.ly/bLb4yN
Get a ife broseph
Fielder Blurbs
Interesting quote, doesnt really sound like something a guy really trying to stay here would say. Sabathia liked it here as well but that didnt go very far with their big money offer. Fielder isnt from here, he’s represented by the biggest agent in the game, and is in line for a top dollar contract. I dont see any hometown discount being given..
And on the Morales thing, thats a very intereting idea. It only works if you expect a big letdown from Morales vs last year. Not huge, but to the level of 2 WAR a year for ’10 and ’11. And in that case the Angles might have to throw in a prospect to even it out. But if you expect not a lot of regression for him, its a pretty even deal.
I agree... it's interesting.
Without actually hearing Fielder make that statement, I think you could interpret it multiple ways. Here’s one possibility…
“I don’t want to let the contract extension discussions to be a distraction, so I’m going to do my job (play baseball) and let my agent do his job (negotiate contracts). If you guys want to ask questions about contract talks, talk to my agent. I’m under Brewers control for two more years. If I’m not here for two more years, it’s not because of anything that I can control (e.g. Brewers trade me).”
by sjlee on Mar 16, 2010 11:49 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
Pretty much
The last part of the quote wasn’t included in the Mug:
“The [contract talk] stuff is great, because it’s business and it’s part of the game. But as far as worrying about it, I can’t worry about it because it’s out of my control.”
So basically, he hired an agent to work out his contract and he isn’t going to concern himself with it during the season.
Get a ife broseph
by Supertramp on Mar 16, 2010 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
And if he isn't here in two years
It’s not his problem, it’s between DM and Boras.
Cya Prince, it’s been really great!
I think he was referring to the fact that if he's not here within the next two years
it’s because he was traded.
by sjlee on Mar 16, 2010 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
True
But the hiring of an Agent to do that job does not bode at all well for the Brewers, given who he hired.
There's some truth to that...
… but in reality I’m not sure it matters who his agent is. The economics are such that it was always going to be difficult for the two sides to come up with an extension everyone could live with once he hit free agency.
Anyway, he’s said often enough before that the decision was his, not Boras’. Not all that many Boras clients make comments like that. Fielder wants his money (who wouldn’t?) but I think he’s demonstrated enough independent thinking that it’s fair to conclude he isn’t going to do what Boras says just because Boras says it. My guess is that now that talks have begun Fielder has realized how difficult or unlikely it is that he’ll end up staying here because of the Brewers financial resources and his value on the open market. The “it’s not my fault” and “it’s out of my control” stuff is probably just a reflection of that realization.
And it’s quite true that baseball’s screwed up economics isn’t his fault. Or the Brewers, for that matter.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions
Agree
I also don’t think it matters too much who his agent is. His first time in FA will be the best chance he has to make as much as possible and I think he wants to take advantage of it.
If it wasn’t Boras it would be a different agent doing the same song and dance with the Brewers management right now.
Get a ife broseph
I don't think many of Boras' clients are taking his word as gospel these days.
A-Rod worked out his own deal with the Yankees, and Lopez ended up firing him.
He's still the best agent in the game
And my guess is that if you fire him, or go against what he says, youre probably a little overconfident in your market value (Lopez) or frustrated with the process (ARod), maybe Fielder could fall into the latter. The difference there is that ARod was dealing with the biggest market team and signed a player friendly deal, probably not going to happen with Fielder.
And on something TSSS said, I just dont think the economics are as bad as what some think. If the Marlins can continually survive the way they have, and the Rays, even when some of those young players start to leave, like Crawford and Upton, will probably continue to be strong a strong team. The Twins, Padres, Rockies are all examples of smaller payroll teams that have had a lot of success living within the limitations of baseballs economic environment. And if you look at each of those teams, its a large focus on scouting and player development, with pitching being included in those efforts.
I guess it all begs the question: When does Melvin realize its time to trade him? When does Attanasio realize it? And how soon will that be?
I guess it all begs the question: When does Melvin realize its time to trade him? When does Attanasio realize it? And how soon will that be?
You seemingly ask that question almost every week on this blog, I’d think you’d have a good idea of where people stand on the issue by now.
Get a ife broseph
It's possible they both already realize this
but they aren’t going to say or do anything until
1. They get a very good offer for him.
2. Sometime next season… particularly if they are out of playoff contention.
"I just don't think the economics are as bad as what some think"
All of the examples of successful (or periodically successful) small and mid market ball clubs regularly or semi-regularly give up ball players to big market teams. They might respond to that need well and do a great job of scouting and player development to stay competitive, but that doesn’t have anything to do with the economics of the game, and it’s certainly not evidence that baseball’s economics aren’t screwed up.
If you want to provide evidence supporting the assertion I’ve quoted above, try again. Because you haven’t provided any so far.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 4:55 PM CDT up reply actions
My thesis is that
If you believe that the economics of baseball are screwed up (i.e. the teams with the smallest revenues and smallest payrolls, or ability to raise both) are at a disadvantage to the teams that can, then the teams that are successful in mid to small markets by utilizing scouting and player development vs signing free agents or big time free agents, while not having the economic means of the larger market teams is a case against your belief.
In the big picture scheme of things, I think it simply “works”. The draft has flaws, the way foreign players are acquired has flaws, and the tv revenue system is flawed, but I still believe that there is not a “problem”, there are discrepancies that benefit larger market teams in many areas of the game, but those discrepancies can be easily overcome by good management. The Minnesota Twins and Florida Marlins are great examples of that. Teams like the Padres, Rockies, Indians, Diamondbacks and Rays to a lesser extent. Each of those teams listed above have had multiple playoff appearances despite their economic shortcomings and scouting and player development has been the basis for each of them to get to that point.
I feel that the Brewers for a time had a great scouting approach, but it only covered one aspect of the game (offense) and they ignored pitching and defense. Part of that problem with the latter was the player development staff. Time will tell if the new focus on pitching in the scouting department turns rewards for the franchise. They also do not seem to have a long term focus, something that the teams listed above have had. There is a very win now no matter the cost type of attitude, and those economic shortcomings you do not like, that the Brewers are owners of, does not fit in well with that type of philosophy.
Ok.
“If you believe that the economics of baseball are screwed up (i.e. the teams with the smallest revenues and smallest payrolls, or ability to raise both) are at a disadvantage to the teams that can, then the teams that are successful in mid to small markets by utilizing scouting and player development vs signing free agents or big time free agents, while not having the economic means of the larger market teams is a case against your belief.”
That just flat out doesn’t make any sense. You acknowledge in your argument that they don’t have the economic means in order to support your position that the economic structure of the MLB doesn’t put them at a disadvantage? Your premise contradicts your conclusion. I never said and do not believe that it’s impossible for small and mid market teams to compete by means other than economic might, and thus the Twins, God bless ‘em, don’t disprove my point or support yours.
Much of your last paragraph is non-responsive to the issue at hand, and quite frankly, a conversation I’m sure you’re as tired of having with me as I am with you. I do appreciate the fact, however, that in your last sentence you essentially admit that baseball’s economic structure is as messed up as I’ve asserted.
Your second paragraph makes more sense, in that your simply saying you don’t care about the economic disparities. That’s a lot different than saying they don’t exist, but whatever. I’ve seen that position taken before by many baseball fans. While I think it’s crap, it’s really just a matter of preference rather than fact, so, cheers.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 17, 2010 12:25 AM CDT up reply actions 4 recs
can I anti-rec a post?
Just because teams are able to overcome a disadvantage doesn’t mean there’s not a disparity that SHOULD be addressed, it just means that the disadvantage is not insurmountable in the short-term.
Also, no low market team has been a dominant force to be reconed with for 10+ years, whereas that’s old hat for large market teams (see Yankees, Red Sox) that don’t have incompetent management. The bar is much lower for a large market team to be able to field a team capable of going .500 or above. And we’re not playing limbo here.
by PagsBrewCrew on Mar 17, 2010 7:24 AM CDT up reply actions
I don't think Lopez fired Boras because he was overestimating his market value.
Unless he overestimated his market value based on what Boras told him, because he signed for way less than what Boras was asking for him once Boras was fired. I don’t disagree that Boras is the best agent in the game (but then, I really have no way of knowing, other than the sheer number of clients he has and the value of the contracts they sign), but that doesn’t mean he didn’t misread the market for Lopez.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 4:58 PM CDT up reply actions
Boras is a very well known agent
But I’m not sure if you can really call him the “best”… depends on the metric.
Some could argue that Arn Tellem is the “best”.
Tellem got two years for Jason Kendall this offseason
And three for Randy Wolf. I think it’s a fair argument.
That's all I've got for you today, unless you're interested in some Chris Capuano/Tom Haudricourt Fan Fiction.
Best agent?
Using what criteria? While it’s true that he has a reputation for getting the biggest contracts for his clients, is it because he has many big name starts?
In other words, who is to say that A-Rod, Teixeira and Manny wouldn’t have gotten comparable contracts if represented by another agent?
BTW – I think the allure of Boras (besides his reputation) is that his commission fees are lower than his competition… or at least they used to be.
I thought the quote...
… sounded more like he was tired of answering the question than an expression of a desire to go elsewhere. It’s pretty clear he’s not going to offer a discount and it’s always been unlikely that he’d sign an extension for that reason. I don’t think his comments indicate he’s unhappy in Milwaukee so much as they indicate that he’d just rather not talk about the situation all the time.
What begins in fear usually ends in folly.
by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Mar 16, 2010 12:46 PM CDT up reply actions
I've posted this before, but Morales is pretty much untouchable
He’s good, he’s cheap, he hits from both sides of the plate, and he’s locked up for a few more years. Even if he regresses this season (and he probably will), he won’t be available for a trade. I also don’t think the Angels are interested in taking on another $15M – $20M+/season in Boras-negotiated salary.
WOW B-ref
has escobar hitting 290. and even more optimistic, soup’s era at 4.87.
Iirc, Escobar played well last September, was raking in winter ball and has started ST hot
If he keeps playing at this pace, .290 isn’t out of the question. It remains ot be seen if he could keep that up for 140+ games, though.
Suppan at 4.87 would be nice to see, though I can’t say I see any way of that happening over the course of the season.
Cappy shutdown.
Very tough news for #Brewers LHP Chris Capuano, who has been shut down after a recurrence of elbow discomfort.
Where the hell is Mykenk?
Yeah, well, sometimes I drink.
by Dikembe Meiztombo on Mar 16, 2010 11:59 AM CDT reply actions
Huge props on taking 1st in singles, holmes
Yeah, well, sometimes I drink.
by Dikembe Meiztombo on Mar 16, 2010 12:02 PM CDT up reply actions
Huh?
like 1B? Or a dating game?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Mar 16, 2010 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions
roto?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Mar 16, 2010 1:29 PM CDT up reply actions
I'm not revealing my grand assumption
That way I won’t look like a fool if I’m wrong.
Yeah, well, sometimes I drink.
by Dikembe Meiztombo on Mar 16, 2010 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions
Riverdance?
"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."
~Doug Melvin
by Charlie Marlow on Mar 16, 2010 6:14 PM CDT up reply actions
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NL Central Standings
| W | L | PCT | GB | STRK | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Cincinnati
|
57 | 46 | .553 | 0 | Won 2 |
|
St. Louis
|
56 | 46 | .549 | 0.5 | Lost 1 |
|
Milwaukee
|
48 | 55 | .466 | 9 | Lost 2 |
|
Chicago
|
46 | 56 | .450 | 10.5 | Lost 2 |
|
Houston
|
42 | 59 | .415 | 14 | Won 2 |
|
Pittsburgh
|
36 | 65 | .356 | 20 | Lost 1 |
(updated 7.30.2010 at 4:51 AM CDT)
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