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Around SBN: Four TCU Football Players Among 17 Arrested In Drug Ring

Tuesday's Frosty Mug

Some things to read while preventing slippage.

Coming into last night's game most of us didn't even expect Chris Capuano to complete five innings, so the fact that he picked up his first win in over three years is one of the more pleasant Brewer surprises in some time. Jaymes Langrehr of The Brewers Bar has a look at just how long it had been. Brett Christopherson of the Appleton Post Crescent thinks Capuano should replace Manny Parra in the rotation. Jack Moore of Disciples of Uecker said he "certainly wouldn't mind seeing Capuano get another chance in the rotation, if the circumstances allow it."

Other notes from the game:

The Brewer bullpen had a 1.69 ERA over their last seven games entering last night's contest. It's now 1.42 over eight games after Todd Coffey, Zach Braddock, Kameron Loe and John Axford combined for four scoreless frames last night.

Yovani Gallardo is expected to return on Thursday, and Adam McCalvy confirmed that Lorenzo Cain will likely be sent down to make room for him. Cain is 2-for-3 in his first few ABs as a Brewer, and it'd be nice to see him get a chance to start once before he's shipped out.

In trade notes:

  • Corey Hart told Tom Haudricourt he's hoping none of the Brewers are dealt "because we think if we stay here, we can be pretty good."
  • ESPN's John Kruk says the Rangers, Rockies, Rays, Giants and Dodgers could all use Prince Fielder, and his size shouldn't be an issue when considering dealing for the slugger.
  • Jeff Fletcher says the Brewers have "no deals currently on table." I'm not sure if he means the Brewers have no deal in play with the Giants, or none at all.

Trevor Hoffman got the day off yesterday, but pitched two scoreless innings over the weekend against the Braves. Aaron Gleeman noted that Hoffman has a 3.38 ERA in 16 appearances since being removed from the closer role.

On the flip side, we have Randy Wolf and Dave Bush. The Hardball Times has them as the NL's second and third worst pitchers, rated by wOBA against.

We spent a fair amount of the day yesterday discussing Carlos Gomez. Jack Moore also weighed in, making the case that the Brewers should have held onto J.J. Hardy and traded Alcides Escobar for pitching.

Eric Arnett made his return to Wisconsin and the Midwest League yesterday and had a pretty good day: He allowed a solo home run but no other hits over six innings, walking three and striking out four. You can read about that performance and more in today's Minor League Notes. I'll stress the fact that I'm not a professional scout, but I was at the game and here's what I saw:

  • Arnett did a nice job recovering from what could have been a disaster in the first. He started the game with six straight balls (including one to the backstop), and his velocity was down (topping out at 89-90). After a walk and an error put runners on first and second, he worked his way out of it with a soft line drive that turned into a double play and a strikeout.
  • After the first, his velocity improved a bit - I saw him hit 92 on the scouts' guns several times between the second and fifth innings.
  • Hitters seemed to have a tougher time than normal making solid contact against him. He got some swinging strikes and a fair amount of weak contact, which is something he struggled with the last time I saw him.
  • Control still seems to be an issue. By my unofficial count he only threw first pitch strikes to two of the first seven batters he faced. Two of his three walks were to leadoff batters.
  • His defense didn't do him a lot of favors. As mentioned above, he had to overcome a first inning error, and backup catcher Austin Stockfisch went 0-for-5 throwing out basestealers on the day.

Elsewhere in the minors:

If you'd like to watch something baseball-related tonight but don't want to watch the Brewer game, you can catch the debut of ESPN's "The Homestand - Milwaukee," which was shot during the Brewers' June series against the Cubs and Rangers and features content shot at the park, in the clubhouse, and in players' homes. I set my DVR for it, but don't know when I'll get around to watching it. Airing it for the first time during a Brewer game is strange timing.

On power rankings:

If you're checking in late this morning, you might have missed Rollie Fingers' nomination post for the SBN Wisconsin Hall of Fame. FtJ is doing a great job with these, so make sure you check them out. Once you're done reading up on Fingers, head over to Anonymous Eagle (Butch Lee) and Bucky's 5th Quarter (Barry Alvarez) to read about their first nominees.

Around baseball:

Braves: Reliever Jonny Venters has been suspended for four games and manager Bobby Cox has been suspended for one game. (FanShot)
Padres: Signed outfielder Wily Mo Pena to a minor league deal.
Rays: Signed outfielder Rocco Baldelli to a minor league deal.
Tigers: Are expected to place third baseman Brandon Inge on the DL with a broken bone in his left hand.

Prince Fielder, by the way, didn't want to talk about Venters' suspension.

Maybe Venters just misread Fielder's feet. The Book Blog has a quote from Cliff Lee about the importance of reading a hitter's feet. I'd never heard of that before, but I guess it makes sense.

Today's best charts and graphs come from Jeremy Greenhouse of the Baseball Analysts, who has a look at correlations between DL time and fastball velocity.

On this day in 1976, Hank Aaron hit his 755th and final major league home run. The Brewers went on to beat the Angels 6-2.

Happy birthday today to 1990-91 Brewer Mark Lee, who turns 46. (h/t FtJ)

Now, if you'll excuse me, I need another new board game.

Drink up.

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At least wolf and bushie

Aren’t CURRENTLY pitching like the 2nd and 3rd worst pitchers invthe NL.. Or at least it doesn’t seem like it.

"Staying up to watch the 10 o'clock Olds? This just in--Go to bed."

by schmita91 on Jul 20, 2010 9:57 AM CDT via mobile reply actions  

"because we think if we stay here, we can be pretty good."

I think we’d all agree that the team as it sits now (well, after Yovani gets off the DL) is significantly better than the team that started the season, and probably would be in contention if not for an awful first couple of months.

Is it possible to crunch the numbers somehow to see what the teams record would be like if they started the year with the team they have right now?

by warwick5s on Jul 20, 2010 10:38 AM CDT reply actions  

I think if you take out Hoffman's "blows"

They are about a .500 team.

The starting pitching staff is just not good enough to make this team a contender. Theyre about 2 pitchers short of being “pretty good”. Even with the stronger bullpen the last 2 months or so, they are still only playing .500 ball since the start of June.

by backtocali on Jul 20, 2010 10:47 AM CDT up reply actions  

.500 is okay

but probably not “pretty good”. i don’t even understand that comment by corey. since this is largely the same team as the beginning of the season, why aren’t they pretty good? does he mean if everyone just plays like their career years (hart now, wolf last year, etc…)? that’s not very realistic.

by Capt Science on Jul 20, 2010 10:49 AM CDT up reply actions  

The bullpen is pretty different

Ditching Suppan and Vargas, Davis’ absence, adding Loe, Axford, and Braddock along with re-ordering roles has really helped.

And I agree, they still wouldn’t be “pretty good” but a .500 team would be in contention in the NL central.

by warwick5s on Jul 20, 2010 10:54 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Bingo. You've pretty much nailed the situation.

Loe, Braddock, and Axford showed enough in AZ in March to warrant inclusion on the April roster, but hey management went conservative and stayed with the “old guys” and promises and dreams of the past to complete the bullpen. You can say that, if the season is lost, it was lost on opening day by management.

"When you really, really break it down the only numbers that count is how many runs you help (produce) and how many runs you save. There’s really not a number for that." --Casey McGehee

by heybatterbatter on Jul 20, 2010 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

You can't cut all those guys

before the season even started.

Hoffman & Vargas are the only two problems the Bullpen has had this year. Vargas didn’t last long, they corrected that pretty swiftly. Hoffman is a different situation.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:07 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

"Can't"...?

What? They’ve got a clause in their contracts? Hawkins, Riske, Davis, Stetter, Suppan, Vargas, Villy and an old Hoffman were never sure things on anybody’s roster. Color the whole bunch “safe,” but not winners necessarily.

Generally, I’m a fan of the current management, but I saw the current “closing committee” show their stuff in Maryvale and I was very impressed (as a fan), that’s all.

"When you really, really break it down the only numbers that count is how many runs you help (produce) and how many runs you save. There’s really not a number for that." --Casey McGehee

by heybatterbatter on Jul 20, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

They were under contract

They cost money. You can’t just cut them, you still have to pay them.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:28 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Happens all the time, cutting with pay. The world of

“big league” ball. Consider the scores of “injured” players who continue on the payroll for entire seasons. Loe, Braddock, and Axford are probably getting the league minimums. Chicken feed in this world….

Managements are genetically conservative. I’m not under any such constraint, thankfully. Just having fun.

"When you really, really break it down the only numbers that count is how many runs you help (produce) and how many runs you save. There’s really not a number for that." --Casey McGehee

by heybatterbatter on Jul 20, 2010 12:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but

it doesn’t happen in the pre-season for no apparent reason, with one of your highest paid players.

Sure, it sounds good in theory, but doesn’t happen nearly as often as you’re making it sound. If it did, it wouldn’t have been a big deal for the Crew to let Suppan go 2 years ago.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

AND obviously I'm using the benefit of hindsight in all this.

Just because the current closing committee looked good in March guarantees nothing for what they might be in July (now). I’m just sayin’ they looked good enough for prime time when I saw them in March.

"When you really, really break it down the only numbers that count is how many runs you help (produce) and how many runs you save. There’s really not a number for that." --Casey McGehee

by heybatterbatter on Jul 20, 2010 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

True, thankfully, but the Brewers organization and the syndicate

controls the organization has Billions of dollars under management.

It’s not how much you have; rather, it’s how smart you are with what you have. That’s what makes baseball management so interesting. I still say that managemen went conservative this spring. It was a bad guess I believe, assuming you were trying to field the best team possible (rather than looking at the bottom line).

If the management really wants to win above all else (which is what fandom wants to believe), the assumption is they will field the best team possible. Even the Almighty Yankees have a budget (albeit unfairly large).

"When you really, really break it down the only numbers that count is how many runs you help (produce) and how many runs you save. There’s really not a number for that." --Casey McGehee

by heybatterbatter on Jul 20, 2010 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

"it's not how much you have; rather it's how smart you are with what you have."

But that’s only half the story, because the more you have, the less smart you have to be.

And that’s a fact. Not to say that the Yanks and other successful big market clubs don’t make smart decisions. They do. But when they blow it, as the Yankees have over the years with their in house pitching development, for example, they can use their superior resources to remedy their failures, whereas small and mid market teams have far less ability to do that. Lots of teams, for example, thought it would be genius to sign Sabathia after 2008. Only one had the financial wherewithal to match or beat (by significant margins) the nearest competing offer.

What begins in fear usually ends in folly.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 20, 2010 3:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

Last year, management stayed with Bill Hall despite his raging lack

of production in spring training and into June. And at the same time, Casey McGehee tears up the Cactus League and shows promise into the season as a bench player, despite having great numbers for the Iowa Cubs the previous year. Why the hesitance? Management hates change!

As I say, managements are conservative (fearing change more than they fear the failure staring at them today) and this fact drives fans crazy most of the time. No wonder, we’re asking for everyone’s head when the performance goes south.

"When you really, really break it down the only numbers that count is how many runs you help (produce) and how many runs you save. There’s really not a number for that." --Casey McGehee

by heybatterbatter on Jul 20, 2010 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Management also has to think about more than production.

Something the fans don’t have to worry about.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Because he's talking about his team mates, and in many cases, his friends.

I don’t think it’s all that surprising that he’s not objective.

What begins in fear usually ends in folly.

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Jul 20, 2010 11:08 AM CDT up reply actions  

i like his public response better than Edmonds'

Edmonds can’t wait to get the f*ck out. Hart likes this team and sees potential. That sort of attitude will help prevent going into extended hitting funks

by PagsBrewCrew on Jul 20, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

I really hope Gerut gets healthy soon

Flipping Edmonds to someone would be really nice.

by warwick5s on Jul 20, 2010 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why?

Do you not like seeing him, or do you think we’d actually get something of value for him?

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think its possible there's a low minors, middling prospect to be had for JEd

He’s obviously proven he can handle playing. A team that wants ‘veteran bench help’ would probably love to have him. See also: Counsell, Craig (2009).

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well right

I’m sure we can get a pile of nothing for him, but I would doubt anything we get for him would ever contribute to a major league team in a meaningful way.

We could get lucky I guess, but how many times has THAT happened?

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Better to play the lottery with the chance to get lucky, than just burn that money, right?

By running out the season with him on the roster, the Brewers accomplish…nothing. He won’t net any draft picks, and they wouldn’t offer him arb anyway. So why not get SOMETHING for him?

Plus, if Hart also gets traded, then they HAVE to play Cain. Unless Gerut’s foot boo boo finally gets better.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fair point, didn't think about that.

Willing to do the same with the rest of the guys on 1 year deals? Not sure who else that is… Edmonds & Counsell, I guess. No big loss if either of those guys gets dealt.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:11 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hoffman

But I doubt anyone would even take him at this point.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

I see what you've got going there

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

The "1 year deal camp"

not the “no one would even take him camp”

I rarely read beyond the subject lines.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

I was thinking

I don’t like camping in the bushes.

But whatever.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yet you usually post only subject lines...

interesting.

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Jul 20, 2010 2:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Piglett

But I actually like him.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Not that he's on a 1 year deal

but he’s a backup type that could be moved. The Brewers control him for the next 3 years after 2010, I believe.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Seems to have more value to someone else who needs a veteran bench outfielder than us, and I don’t know how much he really wants to be here anyways.

Flipping him would be more to make room, not really to get anything great in return.

by warwick5s on Jul 20, 2010 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

What do you think the over/under should be on Win total?

81? 36 more games left against teams above .500, with 21 of those on the road.

If they play .500 the rest of the way that gives them 77 wins.

My guess from here on our would be 74 wins total at year end.

by backtocali on Jul 20, 2010 11:16 AM CDT up reply actions  

The problem is the word ‘could’. They SHOULD be very good right now. But they are not playing like it.

In addition, Corey is at his peak value. Please pack your crap and find a new home

by Saberilliterate on Jul 20, 2010 11:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

+1 for another cappy start.

There is no reason not to. DD and Parra have been given every chance to succede and fail. If he doesn’t work out, no biggie. If he puts up a sub 4 ERA, that would be a boost to the rotation.

by Mr. McGehee on Jul 20, 2010 10:46 AM CDT via mobile reply actions  

Why not?

You think he should stay on the DL longer?

Now that's great tasting chicken!

by Kyle Lobner on Jul 20, 2010 10:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah.

I’m pretty sure he should shut it down for at least 4 weeks.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 11:00 AM CDT up reply actions  

this was my concern

because often oblique injuries can be tricky and result in people overcompensating (resulting in arm injuries). but i really don’t know how severe it was and we have mr biometric webinar on the payroll, so between him and the trainers, they must know what they’re doing…

…if not, i don’t see the need to rush.

by Capt Science on Jul 20, 2010 11:04 AM CDT up reply actions  

I am pretty sure that Rick Peterson doesn't have any sort of formal training

in applied physiology.

He does have a lot of life-training in the Permamullet though.

I think our trainers may suck as well.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions  

I tend to agree

There is absolutely no reason to push it for this team right now. I would much rather we know he is 100%.

Of course, I am not a trainer nor in the locker room and have no idea how he feels.

by Jeo on Jul 20, 2010 11:05 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yo strained his oblique.

From everything I read.

1.) This takes 6-8 weeks to heal.

2.) You can pitch through the pain, however you stand a greater chance of damaging the rotator cuff.

3.) I really think the main reason for pushing Yo to start is to save jobs and perhaps sell tickets.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 11:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

And knowing how players are

I wouldn’t put it past him to play through pain and not tell anyone about it until after he injures himself greater or puts up terrible numbers.

by Jeo on Jul 20, 2010 11:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

Well --

The stupid Brewers let him pitch after he got his knee ripped up.

I can see the same sort of thing happening here.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 11:25 AM CDT up reply actions  

No kidding

When you rip all your tendons out of your knee… you should be able to tell.

I’d say sit him.. the seasons lost already. No need to risk your future.

by SgtClueLs on Jul 20, 2010 11:29 AM CDT up reply actions  

Huh? Rest him to make sure he’s not rushing back from an injury. Not rest him because he’s a fragile china doll.

by SgtClueLs on Jul 20, 2010 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

Here's the thing...

If an oblique strain takes 6-8 weeks to heal — what is the motivation for getting Yo back before that timetable?

If we were in a pennant race or something — that would be one thing – otherwise, it just seems like the FO wants to prevent their firing.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 11:48 AM CDT up reply actions  

Everyone is different

And what if it was a “small” oblique strain or something? What if “oblique strain” is a way of saying he stepped on a rake and it hit him in the nads, but “testicular contusion” wouldn’t have looked good on the 15-day DL.

Give him one start and I’m sure he’ll be on a tight leash because he is that important to the franchise.

by ecocd on Jul 20, 2010 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

yeah, we only have what's reported

again, we have to assume some level of competence by the training staff. so i assume whatever it was is considered sufficiently mild. heck, could’ve been a weird cramp for all i know.

by Capt Science on Jul 20, 2010 4:23 PM CDT up reply actions  

I think you're still suffering

from the Ben “China Doll” Sheets era.

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 11:11 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

I miss him

Maybe we can get him back next year when he’s normal Ben Sheets!

by SgtClueLs on Jul 20, 2010 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

PS – I have an irrational love for Ben.

by SgtClueLs on Jul 20, 2010 11:31 AM CDT up reply actions  

You could have cashed in on that if

You had dolled yourself up and hung around bars on Water Street the past few years.

by backtocali on Jul 20, 2010 11:35 AM CDT up reply actions  

Josh Butler

moving on up, joins the Sounds tonight.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 10:53 AM CDT reply actions  

Prediction

He will make the 2011 bullpen

http://www.mlbsoup.com

by tcyoung on Jul 20, 2010 3:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Big League Stew

has posted a blog about Cap’s win, and the writer asks pretty much the same question as many at the beginning of today’s Mug…. what has the hold up been for putting him in the rotation? (I liked the blog in fan shots)

by tdgbp on Jul 20, 2010 11:08 AM CDT reply actions  

sorry...

that’s LINKED the blog (although I did like it as well…)

by tdgbp on Jul 20, 2010 11:09 AM CDT up reply actions  

Looks like somebody was reading the discussion re: Parra in the Mug yesterday:
Because Parra makes so many poor decisions with pitch selection, Macha suggested he might have to take over that aspect of the game from the dugout.

“You take the decision out of his hands,” said Macha, who did that a bit with Chris Narveson last time out. “We may do that next time with Manny.”

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 11:16 AM CDT reply actions  

I don't recall seeing Parra shake off many signs from the catcher...

wouldn’t poor pitch selection be more the catcher’s fault?

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Jul 20, 2010 1:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe that's part of the problem

re: not shaking off the catcher.

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Let's do it.

He can call the game from the dugout. And be first on the field in Kerwin situations.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Partially.

But he should know when the catcher makes a bad decision, if, in fact, it was the catchers call.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

If he second-guesses the catcher all the time, what good is the catcher?

I think the pitcher should signal to the catcher what he wants and the catcher should shake him off;)

by PagsBrewCrew on Jul 20, 2010 1:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, if he doesn't second guess the catcher ever

then things happen like 0-2 fastballs right down the middle.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Again?

Saying, Parra threw one, it was either his fault or Kottaras fault. Probably should have been a meeting on the mound (Kwiktrip) if they couldn’t agree on a pitch. Oh well, not like that pitch cost them the game.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I know.

But saying that GeoKot “let Parra throw one” implies that Kottaras knew Parra would miss his spot badly.

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 2:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ah

Didn’t mean to imply that. Just meant it was a poor pitch choice, regardless of the intended location, and regardless of who selected it,

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Let?

Oh right… he was supposed to dive in front of the batter.

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Jul 20, 2010 2:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Brian McCann did.

Seems like a pretty good way to get your CS% up. Just don’t let the ball get to the plate.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, I meant more the "fastball" part.

not the “down the middle” part, that’s on Parra.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

I can't remember how narv dog did last time out

I take it the time previous was a disaster and the one before that was when he escaped the 1st inning unscathed and had an excellent game?

by PagsBrewCrew on Jul 20, 2010 1:03 PM CDT up reply actions  

Last four outings...

7/17
6 IP, 6 H, 2 ER, 1 BB, 2 K

7/7
3.1 IP, 9 H, 9 ER, 2 BB, 3 K

7/2
5 IP, 7 H, 4 ER, 0 BB, 4 K (he also gave up 2 runs in the first)

6/27
8 IP, 4 H, 0 ER, 1 BB, 7 K

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Jul 20, 2010 2:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Braun's ISO

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/ryan-brauns-power/

Article on FanGraphs talking about the decrease every year since ROY season. Contact going up, power going down…interesting read.

by backtocali on Jul 20, 2010 11:41 AM CDT reply actions  

Also

was alluded to in fangraphs trade value series…

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 11:42 AM CDT up reply actions  

Kyle would have had it in tomorrow's Mug as well probably

I did a fan post a while back over on Beyond the Boxscore about this, but it was more about luck. Didnt really look at ISO at all.

The whole thing kind of led me to a contradicted conclusion about it. Some said BABIP is a skill, but my thought was then “if its a skill, then why is that stat related to luck if a bad player is having a good year, or a good player having a bad year?” You cant just call it luck when you apply it to certain players and then a skill for others.

The whole thought about it occured to me when I noticed that Braun had quite a number of seeing eye ground balls that went for hits last year. My contention was that (and is kind of being shown this year by Braun again) that when he has a close to average BABIP, he hovers around the .280 batting average line, and years he has been above .300 his BABIP is way above average.

by backtocali on Jul 20, 2010 12:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Weeks or Hart makes a much sense in the 3-hole as Braun, based on the recent trend.

"When you really, really break it down the only numbers that count is how many runs you help (produce) and how many runs you save. There’s really not a number for that." --Casey McGehee

by heybatterbatter on Jul 20, 2010 12:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Agreed

if Braun wants to be a contact hitter, bat him 2nd.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

For those interested

The comments in the article noted Braun’s LHP splits:

07-09 vs Lefties: .364/.432/.708/1.140 (400 ABs)
2010: .237/.306/.351/.657 (97 ABs)
Yes, a nearly .500 point drop in OPS vs LHP

That accounts for a lot of his lost power this year. Don’t really know why this is the case, but it is. Via texasleaguers PitchFX, Braun is seeing substantially more 2-seam fastballs this year at the expense of 4-seam fastballs. Logically, Braun will drive 4-seamers better than 2-seamers.

It’s hard to point to this specifically, because that equates to a total of about 13 balls in play off 2-seem fastballs in 2010 compared to 6 in play in 2009. There might be a hint of anecdotal evidence that lefties are trying to pitch him differently this year.

by ecocd on Jul 20, 2010 2:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Why not?

Who are you going to replace him with?

I’m all for cutting Hoffman when Hawkins is back.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right.

I think there’s two questions:

Why are the Brewers keeping him around?

Why hasn’t he retired?

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 12:44 PM CDT up reply actions  

Answers:

1) No one else to bring on, still need to pay him

2) Doesn’t get paid if he retires.

Plus, he’s good with the kids, remember? He’s a player-coach at this point, or at least the announcers would like you to believe that.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes, I've heard that line.

I guess I just think: if I was the all-time saves leader, and I lost my job and became a mop-up guy, and I’d made around $80 million in my career, and I had a nice house and my family waiting for me in California … I’d be tempted to say: “F this, I’m outta here.”

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 12:57 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree.

He’s gonna stick around ‘till he gets 600, whether it’s with us this year, or with the Padres next year, is my guess.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:58 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Padres next year?

Are they letting Heath Bell go?

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

Some one should tell people

No one cares about save numbers. Never have never will.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

But people care about big round numbers!!

600 saves, 3000 hits, 300 wins… yawn, who cares.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

Wrong.

People care about 3000 hits. People care about 300 wins. People care about 500 HRs. People care about 50 HRs in a season

No one cares about save numbers round or otherwise.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

Maybe in the way some people care about the Washington Nationals.

That’s it - The “save” is the Washington Nationals of the statbook

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

the more casual fan probably cares.

so it’s probably worth a few extra seats being sold when the team is otherwise out of the race shortly.

by Capt Science on Jul 20, 2010 4:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

That's different.

I’m not sure how.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Rollie Fingers was an awesome pitcher.

I didn’t spend a lot of time, talking about his career save totals.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Certainly Hoffman has had a great career.

No one cared when Fingers moved past Wihlhem, back in 1980. Did anyone really remember Jeff Reardon moving past FIngers?

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:12 PM CDT up reply actions  

I did,

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

No, but

I’d be willing to bet that if Hoffman’s not at 600, they sign him to a 1 year, cheap contract, and use him in 3 run save situations early in the year. Get to 600, then have a big party.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

They won't.

Give their 5th OF the first 2 months off.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

Favorite son TGJ

giving way to favorite son Trevor Hoffman?

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 1:10 PM CDT up reply actions  

Speaking of:

In 79 games this year, Junior’s at .226 / .333 / .326.

Never forget.

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Better than our CF, unfortunately

I’ll never denounce the TGJ/Gerut trade, however.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Actually

with CarGo’s successful bunt last night, TGJ and Gomez now have matching .659 OPS’s.

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

What, due to Gomez's higher SLG?

I’d prefer a higher OBP

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yep.

Gomez’s slugging is 40 points higher than TGJ’s, and his OBP is 40 points lower.

And I agree with your point.

SRS BSNS

by Rubie Q on Jul 20, 2010 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

If the team

is completely out of the playoff picture by late August or early September, then I’m sure he’ll be given a chance to close some games to reach 600 this season.

by argichi on Jul 20, 2010 3:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

so, you mean

when math is no longer on our side?

by PagsBrewCrew on Jul 20, 2010 5:45 PM CDT up reply actions  

My problem with Hoffman on the roster...

Is that he seems to be a pitcher that can only be used in certain situations. I guess I’d rather see him replaced with someone that could pitch in a higher-leverage situation if needed.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 12:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

Such as?

I say, as long as that need doesn’t manifest itself, and as long as he’s performing in the role he’s in, there’s not really a justification for cutting him. Trading him, definitely, but not just dumping the guy.

Again, when Hawkins comes back (and, in my head, retakes over the 8th inning role) that’s something to think about.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:35 PM CDT up reply actions  

+1

Yeah, Hoffmann struggled early on, but he has really come around since his previous blown save. I’d like to see him get more opportunities and give Axford some more rest once in a while. I’m chearing Hoffmann on to get 600 saves. Lets not force him to fall short on that because of his performance very early in the year.

I don’t remember Latroy Hawkins too much, but from what I do recall, he wasn’t anything special. Well, at least from what i remember. I still like Kameron Loe. I think he’s a beast as our setup man. Everytime he goes in at the end of the 7th or in the 8th inning, i feel like the Brewers have the game wrapped up as Axford will close it out in the 9th. I never had that feeling with any other pitchers.

"No player is greater than a team."
-Vince Lombardi

by Jabooty on Jul 20, 2010 12:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well

only Riske, Axford, and Braddock have been better out of the pen than Hawkins. So, he was good. Will he be when he gets back? Maybe, maybe not. I’m guessing he doesn’t get high leverage situations right away anyway, will probably take Coffey or CV’s place, assuming they’re not traded.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:53 PM CDT up reply actions  

Seriously

Its starting to get annoying, you banging the LaTroy Hawkins drum. Process AND results are important, right?

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 12:54 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yep.

The results weren’t bad either though. So it’s okay.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 12:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

12 runs have scored in his 11.2 IP

I know all about his BABIP, FIP tRA, tRA+, tERA, luck, poor defense, etc. But if you ask me, those aren’t beneficial results.

Are you really that surprised that anyone could be upset with his results?

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:09 PM CDT up reply actions  

I'm not at all surprised

that people are upset with his results. But results aren’t necessarily (or even ordinarily) the best way to project future performance, which is all I really care about.

In terms of his results, his last outing he was hurt, and still hasn’t recovered, I discount those runs somewhat. There’s no one that will disagree that he was misused in the Chicago game, and shouldn’t have been in the game to face Fukudome. Sure, the runs might have still scored, no one knows what would have happened if the right decision was made there.

The Washington game sucked, no question.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:14 PM CDT up reply actions  

Right, I'm just saying

everytime someone says “Hawkins sucks” you say “no, he doesn’t”. Its just kind of tiresome. Anyone who takes the time to delve into the stats understands that “Hawkins sucks” is a pretty ridiculous statement.

I don’t know why its irritating me today, though.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

Sorry to be post police, I actually didn't intend it.

Don’t know why, but it rubbed me wrong today.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

CV

I completely forgot that he was still in the bullpen. Last outing was 7/8.

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Jul 20, 2010 1:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hoffman

Sort of reminds me of Gagne in 2008. High hopes…early implosion leading to set up role…decent results as a set up man…but always had the feeling the next implosion was right around the corner.

by Infield Fly Rule on Jul 20, 2010 3:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

I feel more hatred for Gagne

because hoffman gave us one good year, and is at least making 2.5 mil less than gagne

by Jeo on Jul 20, 2010 3:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

They are waiting to trade him for an A-ball never-was in August

Maybe he should play first base instead. That is, he should lie out there and we can step on him when we get a hit.

by TheJay on Jul 20, 2010 12:19 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ruben Flores

and his 1.97 WHIP and 8.1 BB/9 hate you.

by thevaccinator27 on Jul 20, 2010 12:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fielder's 23 home runs

I’m just amazed at his bad luck. You would think that batting 3rd and 4th in this lineup he’d have men on base ahead of him, but of his league-leading 23 home runs, 19 have been solo shots, and 4 have been 2-run HRs (driving in Hart and Braun each twice). He’s leading the league in HRs, but he’s fifth on his own team in RBI.

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 12:29 PM CDT reply actions  

I wonder how much of Prince's bad luck

Is coming in the form of Weeks/Hart/Braun clearing the bases ahead of him with their own HRs.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

another thing to keep in mind

home runs that lead off innings. not sure if there are lots of them, but it would be another factor artificially deflating his rbi totals

by dtmeyers on Jul 20, 2010 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

I get what you're saying

but I don’t think you can make that statement with 100% certainty. Too many outside influencing factors.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I definitely understand

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

12 of them have come with no outs and nobody on base

Last year 34 runners scored on 46 HRs, this year 4 scored on 23.

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

How's this one:
Rk	Player		RC
1	Prince Fielder	74
2	Rickie Weeks	73
3	Corey Hart	64
4	Ryan Braun	60
5	Casey McGehee	52
6	Alcides Escobar	29
7	Jim Edmonds	27
8	Carlos Gomez	22
9	George Kottaras	22
10	Joe Inglett	16
11	Craig Counsell	15
12	Gregg Zaun	13
13	Jonathan Lucroy	10
14	Yovani Gallardo	6
15	Jody Gerut	5
16	Randy Wolf	4
17	Manny Parra	3
18	Chris Narveson	3
19	Lorenzo Cain	2
20	David Bush	1
		

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:46 PM CDT up reply actions  

Runs created?

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Jul 20, 2010 1:48 PM CDT up reply actions  

Full description

Though I’m not sure which of the approachs bbref uses: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runs_created

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Because it's theoretical.

It’s not just allocating the runs actually scored to each player. That’s what RBI’s do.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

Ok, so what I should take away from it is

That Prince should be scoring/driving in more runs than he is based on his overall production

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

I still think we should bat Prince in the leadoff spot

We’ve got five cleanup hitters and no running game, why not bat they guy they like to walk first since he’s hitting solo shots anyway.

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 2:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

Is it really bad luck?

Or that he’s not swinging the bat well in higher pressure situations?

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Jul 20, 2010 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Great question

Bases empty, his OPS is 1.128, with RISP it’s .629.
69% of his total bases have come with the bases empty.

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Could I respectfully request something?

Could you please refrain from posting the CoolStandings playoff chances now. It’s a bit redundant since it’s always 0.5%-1% and I doubt it’s accurate down to that small of probability. More importantly, it’s ever so slightly depressing every time I see it.

by ecocd on Jul 20, 2010 12:54 PM CDT reply actions  

Breaking "News":

Pinella’s retiring after the season.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:01 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

Ryne Sandberg will be the next Cub manager

And they will take on a big youth movement in the next few years.

by backtocali on Jul 20, 2010 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Iowa Cubs

are the second worse kind of Cubs.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Where does Daytona rank?

Maybe he should play first base instead. That is, he should lie out there and we can step on him when we get a hit.

by TheJay on Jul 20, 2010 1:47 PM CDT up reply actions  

Here's how I rank them

1.) Nazi Cubs
2.) Jim Belushi/Cub Fans
3.) Chicago Cubs
4.) Iowa Cubs
5.) Panda Cubs
6.) Daytona Cubs.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:49 PM CDT up reply actions  

Pandas just sit around the house, doing nothing but eating bamboos

and they don’t wear pants, yet they should.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 2:21 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Back in the late 70s-early 80s

they were part of the industrial revolution in China.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   2 recs

I don't mind Cub Scouts

I don’t like Boy Scouts though.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Blues Brother reference

will earn you a rec

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Clarification

Do you mean fans of Jim Belushi & Cub fans or are you referring to Jim Belushi as an example of a Cub fan? I can understand both interpretations.

Maybe he should play first base instead. That is, he should lie out there and we can step on him when we get a hit.

by TheJay on Jul 20, 2010 2:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hmm.

1.) I am quite certain Jim Belushi does not have fans.

2.) I was referring to Jim Belushi as example of a Cub fan.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

RT: @cnntech: Playboy wants you to check them out at work. This new site look SFW to you? — http://on.cnn.com/as3kA4 #cnn

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:09 PM CDT reply actions  

I like the headline "How to get laid at work"

Reminds me of that Tom Brady SNL skit.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:16 PM CDT up reply actions  

Link

Here

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 1:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Just to get it out there

I agree 100% with Jack Moore’s analysis. I was rowing the ‘keep Hardy, trade Escobar’ boat.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:27 PM CDT reply actions  

I wonder what

the fan reaction to that would have been.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah,

but the intersection of “ladies” and “fans” isn’t that large.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

"Sluts"?

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Too far?

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:42 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hey now!

I’m going to go ahead and resent that.

My goodness.

by BrewHaHeather on Jul 21, 2010 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

Right

“What The Mustache Does” vs. “What I Think Should Be Done” are very rarely one and the same.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 1:41 PM CDT up reply actions  

Small World

Let us know how you like the game. I was thinking about Small World or Dominion for my next board game.

by grant76 on Jul 20, 2010 1:45 PM CDT reply actions  

My hopes are high for it

My wife and I are full-on Ticket to Ride addicts. If you don’t like that game, you sniff glue.

by Cheeseandcorn on Jul 20, 2010 2:01 PM CDT up reply actions  

Now I feel bad.

You were supposed to be snarky.

Taking shallowness to new depths -- FtJ's blog

by Fatter than Joey on Jul 20, 2010 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yeah

I couldn’t come up with anything, so I decided to make you feel bad.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

I’ve played Ticket to Ride online quite a bit (great game). Catan and Carcassonne are what I’ve been playing lately.

by grant76 on Jul 20, 2010 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

Both great games.

Ticket to Ride has a completely different feel on the board than online. I play online every once a while, but an in-person game with friends (obviously) blows the online experience away.

by Cheeseandcorn on Jul 20, 2010 2:40 PM CDT up reply actions  

Esky moving on up:

Rickie Weeks 2B
Corey Hart RF
Ryan Braun LF
Prince Fielder 1B
Casey McGehee 3B
Jim Edmonds CF
Alcides Escobar SS
Jonathan Lucroy C
Dave Bush RHP

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:13 PM CDT reply actions  

Was just going to post this

and ask someone to explain why Escobar moves up in the lineup ahead of LuCroy.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yostian

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:29 PM CDT up reply actions  

I might buy that a little more than sjlee's

but I still think its horse manure.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 3:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Also

Anyone else read Tom H.’s little piece about the White Sox wanting FIelder? He implies that the Brewers will want Daniel Hudson and Dayan Viciedo to START with, and that the Brewers would have to send a Narveson or Parra back in the deal.

Of course Ken Rosenthal is saying the Sox don’t want Fielder. But, that’s the Ken Rosenthal Spaghetti Method of Journalism™ if you ask me.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:19 PM CDT reply actions  

Hmm

I think the Brewers are insane if they think they’re getting Hudson & Vicideo, or if they think that the White Sox want Chris Narveson.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:24 PM CDT up reply actions  

The Sox would get a year and a half of the best slugger in baseball

And Prince’s second halfs are as good as most players’ entire seasons.

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 2:26 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

True

but that’s way too high a price for them to pay, imo.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:27 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think so.

I think you’re spoiled by watching this team hit HRs by the bushel every day. Add a few dingers to a team that can already stay in games with their pitching and it goes a long way.

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 2:30 PM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

Yes

but 6 years of good pitching + 6 years of good first base > 1.5 years of Prince DH’ing.

Don’t get me wrong, I’d LOVE that trade to go down. But it’s not going to happen.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

As would I.

It won’t.

And, as Jack pointed out on DIsciples of Uecker, I’ll bet Kenny Williams response to Melvin’s “Fielder for Hudson and Viciedo+” would be “lol”

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

by Charlie Marlow on Jul 20, 2010 2:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

Screw that, I'd pull the trigger.

The Twins are already a good team and their stars are locked down long-term, I’m not taking any chances with the few opportunities to get to the postseason I’ll get for the next few years.

by nullacct on Jul 20, 2010 2:36 PM CDT up reply actions  

So, sell the future to play for today.

And the twins aren’t THAT much better than the White Sox.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 2:37 PM CDT up reply actions  

What makes the prospects guaranteed to be good all six years?

Maybe he should play first base instead. That is, he should lie out there and we can step on him when we get a hit.

by TheJay on Jul 20, 2010 3:55 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fielder is going to be terrible next April

So they’re not going to be getting a full season and a half out of him, either. ;-)

by ecocd on Jul 20, 2010 3:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well, yeah

I just thought it was strange you’d consider those guys locks to be good for six years when you aren’t willing to give Lorenzo Cain a shot over Gomez. Whatever, I guess.

Maybe he should play first base instead. That is, he should lie out there and we can step on him when we get a hit.

by TheJay on Jul 20, 2010 4:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't want Cain to get a shot over Gomez

because I see them both in the OF for the next whatever years. I want them playing together.

Shruggity.

by Mykenk on Jul 20, 2010 4:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

Fair enough

I just think even two top prospects are far from a guaranteed six good years under team control and are certainly less of a guarantee than a guy who has been in the majors for five years. Doesn’t much matter though.

Maybe he should play first base instead. That is, he should lie out there and we can step on him when we get a hit.

by TheJay on Jul 20, 2010 4:10 PM CDT up r