Most Valuable Brewers: Vote For #6:

by Kyle Lobner on Oct 31, 2011 3:00 PM CDT in Most Valuable Brewers 2011

Here's where we stand so far:

1. Ryan Braun
2. Prince Fielder
3. John Axford
4. Yovani Gallardo
5. Zack Greinke

Who's #6? That's up to you to decide.

Poll

Who was 2011's sixth most valuable Brewer?

Carlos Gomez

3 votes

Corey Hart

43 votes

Kameron Loe

5 votes

Jonathan Lucroy

28 votes

Shaun Marcum

167 votes

Nyjer Morgan

128 votes

Chris Narveson

3 votes

Francisco Rodriguez

30 votes

Rickie Weeks

71 votes

Randy Wolf

18 votes

496 votes | Poll has closed

Tweet Comment 43 comments | 0 recs |

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Comments

If Shaun Marcum beats Tony Plush I am getting Cameron Garfield to detonate the site.

Just a warning!

"We’re here to win, man. All that fighting stuff, that’s for the birds." - Prince Fielder

by SRB on Oct 31, 2011 5:57 PM CDT reply actions

See, I was going to say the exact opposite

I mean, the Tony Plush show was fun and all, but come on, he’s a platooning center fielder. Shaun Marcum was just about the only starting pitcher standing between this team and abject mediocrity from April to June.

by Cheeseandcorn on Oct 31, 2011 7:14 PM CDT up reply actions 5 recs

Agreed

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

"Something always good seems to happen when he's in there. Numbers matched up good."

~RRR

by Charlie Marlow on Oct 31, 2011 11:00 PM CDT up reply actions

Wow, seriously?

Nyjer Morgan fWAR: 4.0
Shaun Marcum fWAR: 2.7

"We’re here to win, man. All that fighting stuff, that’s for the birds." - Prince Fielder

by SRB on Nov 1, 2011 5:47 PM CDT up reply actions

Is WAR really a good measurement when comparing pitchers and position players?

Seems like Verlander (fWAR 7.0) was more valuable this season than Bautista (fWAR 8.3).

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 2, 2011 10:28 AM CDT up reply actions

Vote Marcum!

"fortunate, but also lucky"

by Ted Simmons Speed Camp on Oct 31, 2011 7:27 PM CDT up reply actions

Morgan gets my vote because

Without him, We’d have had to deal with Mark Fucking Kotsay as the every day CF.

I got goons.

by Dikembe Meiztombo on Oct 31, 2011 8:00 PM CDT up reply actions

Marcum over Morgan or Weeks?

that’s just not right

I am too drunk to taste this chicken.

by ThroughBeingCool on Oct 31, 2011 7:52 PM CDT reply actions

I konw right.

Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.

by cooper82 on Oct 31, 2011 8:17 PM CDT up reply actions

Hart had a better season than all 3 of them

by backtocali on Nov 1, 2011 8:49 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

Depends on what metric you're looking at

If you’re going solely on WAR, then you’re right, Hart had a higher WAR than all three of them.

If you’re going by WPA or Clutch, then it’s Morgan, Weeks, then Hart.

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:15 AM CDT up reply actions

Not to mention the flaws in WAR when you have people so close together

The difference between 4.0 and 4.5 WAR is pretty much negligible due to statistical noise, especially with UZR.

by cwolf20 on Nov 1, 2011 11:18 AM CDT up reply actions

Somebody below made a very good point about Morgan's wOBA and WAR

going down if he had to face LHP.

Give him an offspeed pitch down and in. He will swing and miss.

by cooper82 on Nov 1, 2011 7:16 PM CDT up reply actions

Not sure who does FanShots

Or even if its FanShot material, but Larussa retired today.

Brewers fan lost in South Carolina.

by SCBrewer on Oct 31, 2011 7:54 PM CDT via mobile reply actions

It was fanshotted early this morning.

by Noah Jarosh on Oct 31, 2011 8:50 PM CDT up reply actions

And again later this morning!

Now that's great tasting chicken!

by Kyle Lobner on Oct 31, 2011 9:09 PM CDT up reply actions

Everyone can do a FanShot

And as you can see… it’s been done… multiple times.

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:16 AM CDT up reply actions

Not sure who does FanShots

Or even if its FanShot material, but Larussa retired today.

Brewers fan lost in South Carolina.

by SCBrewer on Oct 31, 2011 7:54 PM CDT via mobile reply actions

It was fanshotted early this morning.

fka "warwick5s"

by DEUCE SLUICE on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs

And again later this morning!

fka "warwick5s"

by DEUCE SLUICE on Oct 31, 2011 11:16 PM CDT up reply actions 2 recs

Deja vu?

Is that you?

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:17 AM CDT up reply actions

Not exactly topic related...but Betancourt...a type B free agent? WTF?

Grillax people

by jmeks23 on Oct 31, 2011 8:16 PM CDT reply actions

Largely based on playing time.

Now that's great tasting chicken!

by Kyle Lobner on Oct 31, 2011 9:10 PM CDT up reply actions

I'd argue that it's completely opposite of the topic

Yuni = Least Valuable Brewer

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:18 AM CDT up reply actions

Stumping for Corey Hart

I didn’t think I was high on Corey or anything, but this poor young man, he needs the love

by Waterologist on Oct 31, 2011 10:29 PM CDT reply actions 1 recs

stunned

At little support Hart is getting. He had a REALLY good offensive year. He was 17th in the NL in OPS, just behind CarGo, Pence, and Reyes, and ahead of guys like Howard, McCutcheon, and Weeks (by 40 points). He was only 50 points behind Pujols.

Now, all things being equal, I would take a 2B like Weeks with the 40 point OPS loss, but not when Weeks missed 40 games or whatever (for the record, I think Weeks is underrated by a lot of Brewer fans too).

I can’t for the life of me figure out how he is getting destroyed by Nyjer. Yeah, Nyjer played CF and that has some value, but neither is a defensive stalwart. Meanwhile, his OPS is about 100 points less and he was platooned for much of the year.

Corey Hart isn’t a great player, but he is a pretty darn good one and I am surprised that he isn’t thought of higher by Crew fans.

by badgermaniac on Nov 1, 2011 12:27 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

Just for kicks

Here is how they ranked in terms of wins above replacement…

Braun 7.8
Fielder 5.5
Hart 4.2
Morgan 4.0
Greinke 3.9
Weeks 3.7
Gallardo 3.1
Marcum 2.7
Gomez 2.0
Lucroy 1.9
Axford 1.9

Based on this, Hart should have been #3 while Axford barely cracks the top 10. (Not sure how many Brewer fans would put his value beneath Gomez.)

by badgermaniac on Nov 1, 2011 12:39 AM CDT up reply actions

Have to look at some leverage for Axford

It’s going to undervalue relief pitchers a bit. A starter gets 200 innings at 1 leverage and an elite reliever gets 70 innings at 2 leverage, that’s like multiplying his value by 2 in a sense. You can’t just add it to his WAR because it’s based on the opportunities he gets, though. His 4.29 WPA is a lot more indicative of his value, and that’s a metric in terms of wins too. That’s third on the team behind Braun and Fielder (though it doesn’t have anything to say about defense).

E: George 4 (5, throw, throw, throw, throw).

by Jordan M on Nov 1, 2011 12:52 AM CDT up reply actions 1 recs

I thought defense was calculated into WAR

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:19 AM CDT up reply actions

It is.

But not into WPA.

by placidity on Nov 1, 2011 9:30 AM CDT up reply actions

My bad

I thought he was referring to WAR in his last sentence.

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:37 AM CDT up reply actions

If we were solely going to rank the team based on WAR why bother even having a poll?

Pitchers seem to get undervalued in terms of WAR.

Also, Morgan’s WAR is only .2 below Hart’s… despite playing less (122 PAs, 33 less starts).

Other things to consider… WPA and Clutch… both of which have Morgan ranked higher than Hart.

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:23 AM CDT up reply actions

Morgan played less because he can't hit lefties.

I’m pretty convinced that more starts and plate appearances would have reduced Morgan’s WAR and WPA. A decent chunk of Morgan’s value comes from having a capable right-handed center fielder to platoon with and limit Morgan’s opportunities against lefties.

by placidity on Nov 1, 2011 9:35 AM CDT up reply actions 2 recs

Good point

Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.

by sjlee on Nov 1, 2011 9:39 AM CDT up reply actions

Excellent point.

"If we want to sign a Type A free agent, we would lose a second-round pick, but we don't have a way to get picks back. Our whole Draft process needs to be redone."

~Doug Melvin

"Something always good seems to happen when he's in there. Numbers matched up good."

~RRR

by Charlie Marlow on Nov 1, 2011 10:53 AM CDT up reply actions

Interestingly

I was looking through an old Baseball American Almanac and saw that Morgan’s basestealing in AAA in 2008 was actually fairly decent (44 out of 52). Not sure what has happened to him now on that front…

"I love it when any team called 'The Brew Crew' wins": Tad Kubler
"LOLOL I LOVE YUNI!!!!": ThroughBeingCool

by MrLeam on Nov 1, 2011 11:23 AM CDT up reply actions

~Doug Melvin

"Something always good seems to happen when he's in there. Numbers matched up good."

~RRR

by Charlie Marlow on Oct 31, 2011 11:01 PM CDT up reply actions

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NL Central Standings

	W	L	PCT	GB	STRK
Cincinnati Red Reporter	25	20	.555	0	Lost 1
St. Louis Viva El Birdos	25	21	.543	0.5	Lost 2
Houston The Crawfish Boxes	22	23	.488	3	Won 4
Pittsburgh Bucs Dugout	21	24	.466	4	Won 1
Milwaukee Brew Crew Ball	19	26	.422	6	Won 2
Chicago Bleed Cubbie Blue	15	30	.333	10	Lost 10