Larkin Elected To Hall Of Fame, Burnitz And Young Fall Off Ballot
by Kyle Lobner on Jan 9, 2012 1:00 PM CST
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PrintAs seen moments ago on MLB Network, Barry Larkin is the only honoree in this year's Hall of Fame balloting.
The former Brewers on this year's ballot were Jeromy Burnitz (1996-2001) and Eric Young (2002-03). Neither received the 5% of the vote they'd have to get to appear on the ballot again next season. Young received one vote, Burnitz no votes.
No former Brewers have been elected to the Hall of Fame since Paul Molitor made it on the first ballot in 2004.
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Tom H revealed his ballot
Larkin, Morris, Lee Smith, Raines, McGriff.
He said in regards to bagwell:
After Listening to others I respect, regret not including Bagwell. Next year, I will.
It’s bulsh that you didn’t this year tom, but at least you’ve seen the light.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
BCB Fantasy Football League 1 Champ
by Hyatt on Jan 9, 2012 1:43 PM CST reply actions 1 recs
And he's going for Raines too
Of course, he would have had time to listen to the views of other people he respects on Bagwell but he was too excited by his ballot for the Hall of Metereology Fame that he had to fill in by the same deadline…
BCB Fantasy Football 2011 winner (Swansons League)
"LOLOL I LOVE YUNI!!!!": ThroughBeingCool
by MrLeam on Jan 9, 2012 1:53 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Storm Davis is jealous
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
BCB Fantasy Football League 1 Champ
by Hyatt on Jan 9, 2012 1:56 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
There's hope
for Yuniesky yet…
BCB Fantasy Football 2011 winner (Swansons League)
"LOLOL I LOVE YUNI!!!!": ThroughBeingCool
Not really
Despite being pretty bad defensively, Young was decent at the plate.
Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.
Other vote getters
Jack Morris 67% (not bad for a guy whose ERA+ is 105 career, like David Wells, 2 years left on the ballot)
Bagwell 56% (15% jump)
Lee Smith 51%
Raines 49% (more than double two years ago)
Trammel and Edgar Martinez 39% (both should be much higher in my opinion)
McGriff 24%
Walker 23%
MacGwire 20%
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
BCB Fantasy Football League 1 Champ
It'll be really interesting to see
what Bagwell gets in comparison to some of the guys coming on the ballot next year…
BCB Fantasy Football 2011 winner (Swansons League)
"LOLOL I LOVE YUNI!!!!": ThroughBeingCool
Complete Vote Totals
2012 Hall of Fame Voting
Name Votes (%) Yrs on ballot
Barry Larkin 495 (86.4%) 3
Jack Morris 382 (66.7%) 13
Jeff Bagwell 321 (56.0%) 2
Lee Smith 290 (50.6%) 10
Tim Raines 279 (48.7%) 5
Alan Trammell 211 (36.8%) 11
Edgar Martinez 209 (36.5%) 3
Fred McGriff 137 (23.9%) 3
Larry Walker 131 (22.9%) 2
Mark McGwire 112 (19.5%) 6
Don Mattingly 102 (17.8%) 12
Dale Murphy 83 (14.5%) 14
Rafael Palmeiro 72 (12.6%) 2
Bernie Williams 55 (9.6%) 1
Juan Gonzalez 23 (4.0%) 2
Vinny Castilla 6 (1.0%) 1
Tim Salmon 5 (0.9%) 1
Bill Mueller 4 (0.7%) 1
Brad Radke 2 (0.3%) 1
Javy Lopez 1 (0.2%) 1
Eric Young 1 (0.2%) 1
Jeromy Burnitz 0 (0%) 1
Brian Jordan 0 (0%) 1
Terry Mulholland 0 (0%) 1
Phil Nevin 0 (0%) 1
Ruben Sierra 0 (0%) 1
Tony Womack 0 (0%) 1
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
BCB Fantasy Football League 1 Champ
next year's class is ridiculous, so I don't expect Morris to be a sure thing
Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Craig Biggio, Curt Schilling, Sammy Sosa, Mike Piazza, Kenny Lofton. Piazza and Schilling should get the Bagwell treatment, Biggio should be good on the 1st ballot, Lofton as an eventual, I see Sosa getting the MacGwire status, and I have no idea what voters would do with Bonds and Clemmens. Both are 1st ballot achievers, but that alleged PED use will factor heavily.
Though it’s a joke that they won’t get in first ballot.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
BCB Fantasy Football League 1 Champ
Bonds, Clemens
I think they both get elected, maybe not first time around, but both players were HOF worthy before the steriod issues were a part of their career.
Bonds was a top 20 player before 2002 and Clemens was a bit further down the list, but still worthy before his Toronto days.
They can't possibly be 1st ballot HOF given their PED use
But I agree with you that they’re both simply too good to keep out of the HOF entirely, PEDs or no.
Bonds might not get in.
Even though he’s the greatest baseball player of all time, he committed the cardinal sin of angering the mighty sports media.
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
by SRB on Jan 9, 2012 4:10 PM CST up reply actions
Disagree about him being the "greatest baseball player of all time"
Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.
Maybe not, IMO he clearly had the most valuable career though
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
by SRB on Jan 9, 2012 4:46 PM CST up reply actions
Exactly
Ruth had a higher career WAR and did it while playing in fewer games.
Pujols is the Barack Obama of baseball.
Not necessarily
Ruth is at 177 fWAR, Bonds is at 168 fWAR, but:
1) Does anyone think Ruth was actually a plus fielder? I don’t think fielding metrics that old are very reliable, and I find it hard to believe that Ruth was very good in the outfield.
2) Ruth’s stats are inflated because IBB were not recorded then, so all of his IBB (surely a huge number) are counted as normal BB, while Bonds’s nearly 700 career IBB are counted at a much lower value (and aren’t included at all in wOBA).
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
by SRB on Jan 9, 2012 8:09 PM CST up reply actions
Actually
1. Yeah, I bet Ruth was pretty good in the OF. He was pretty tall so he could cover some ground, probably fairly fast out there (13 seasons with 5 or more triples) and he had an arm strong enough that he broke in as a pitcher.
2. Bonds’ stats are inflated because he stabbed himself in the ass with steroids.
Mark Attanasio is the best.
by nullacct on Jan 10, 2012 11:46 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Larry Walker
1997 MVP, 5-time AS, 7-time GG OF. He hit for power, average, stole bases, and gunned out runners taking an extra base. Three batting titles (.313 career average), and a career OPS of .965 – 16th all-time. He was the real deal. Regularly ranting against steroids, he was able to hold his own against their inflated numbers. This guy should have been a 1st ballot inductee.
Mark Attanasio is the best.
What would happen in a matchup of Balfour vs. Walker?
Applying pop culture to Brewers discussions since 2009, earning the nickname of "Our Little Abed".
by Yar Nivek on Jan 9, 2012 2:53 PM CST up reply actions 1 recs
probably got discounted considering he spent a lot of his career in coors before they moved the fences back
And yes, I know he still had over .600 slugging in 03 and 04, but pre-2002 coors was a launching pad.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
BCB Fantasy Football League 1 Champ
huh?
Career 2160 hits, 383 HR over 17 seasons. Over the exact same stretch Ken Griffey Jr. had 2304 hits and 536 HR.
Regardless of your personal beliefs, HOF voting takes into account being able to stay on the field and during the same stretch, KGJ had 1000 more PA than Walker. KGJ is the benchmark for the very best of hitters from 1989 to 2005. Larry Walker’s total numbers simply don’t match up.
Walker was a fantastic player while on the field, but his (lack of) longevity doesn’t justify a place in the Hall of Fame.
The same negative can be said for Barry Larkin, who just got elected
Larkin played 19 years, but averaged only 114 games a season. Walker averaged 117.
Mark Attanasio is the best.
Right, but if you could have one or ther other there's almost no reason to pick Walker over Larkin.
Walker was a very good hitter, but Larkin was no slouch either and played a significantly more valuable defensive position. You mentioned that Walker was a five time All Star. Larkin was a twelve time All Star and won eight Silver Sluggers.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
by Kyle Lobner on Jan 10, 2012 10:45 AM CST up reply actions
I'll disagree with that also
Larkin may have played (arguably) a more difficult position, but he certainly didn’t play it as well. Not only did Walker have much better offensive production over his career (+.150 OPS higher than Larkin) but he was worth 9.6 WAR as a fielder – to Larkin’s 2.3. Not winning the Silver Slugger every year might have something to do with playing the same position as juicers Bonds and Sosa.
Mark Attanasio is the best.
I bet Larry Walker took steroids.
But yes, I think he should get in too. +73.2 career fWAR
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
by SRB on Jan 9, 2012 4:14 PM CST up reply actions
Probably the most unlikely thing ever.
"I’m living proof that I didn’t take them because when I retired I put on 15 pounds – I didn’t shrink. An old saying in baseball says ‘If you’re not cheating, you’re not trying’ – pitchers with pine tar and runners on second giving signs, but sticking a needle in you is stepping over the boundary of the sport and what you’re supposed to do."
If there’s anyone who could have benefitted from them it would have been him, due to all the games missed with assorted injuries, but he was absolutely dead-set against steroids. In his opinoin “there should be an asterisk placed next to the name of any person caught using steroids.”
Mark Attanasio is the best.
The Larry doth protest too much, methinks.
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
I made up the Steroid Era?
Lots of players took steroids. Deal with it.
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
"doth protest too much"
Is a phrase used to insinuate that a person is being negative more than necessary to hide a fault. When you used it, you implied he was guilty. So, go for it, make up some shit.
Mark Attanasio is the best.
by nullacct on Jan 10, 2012 11:36 AM CST up reply actions 1 recs
Hall of Fame
You know how people get all caught up in linguistic arguments about “Most Valuable Player” needing you to assess not actually how good a player necessarily is but how “valuable” they were (thereby giving a bonus to players on good teams)? How come the same people don’t argue from a linguistic perspective that the Hall of Fame shouldn’t have the best baseball players in but merely the most famous? That way we could get away without the tedious voting and just carry out an opinion poll among the general population on what baseball players from the list people can remember…
BCB Fantasy Football 2011 winner (Swansons League)
"LOLOL I LOVE YUNI!!!!": ThroughBeingCool
No good.
People are going to remember Mr. Golden Hands for years to come.
Applying pop culture to Brewers discussions since 2009, earning the nickname of "Our Little Abed".
You get negative points when it's revealed two thirds of the way through the season that the announcers have been pronouncing your name wrong.
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
by SRB on Jan 9, 2012 4:16 PM CST up reply actions
I think Jim Abbott, for example, collected a few Hall of Fame votes based on that premise.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
I can't wait for Eckstein to be available for like 3 years on ballots.
you know he’ll make it on scrap alone.
"That's not a weird stat. Rickie is a run-scorer," Yost said. "It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter," Yost told reporters. "See, you guys have no concept. He's a run-scorer. So there's nothing weird about it. That's what he does."
BCB Fantasy Football League 1 Champ
Why is the Internet so upset about Jack Morris getting votes?
Career +56.9 fWAR, that’s really good.
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
I feel like Jack Morris' name comes up exactly once a year, when people argue about his HoF candidacy.
And the fact that it’s the only time he ever comes up should tell you something.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
I don't talk about Barry Larkin much either.
Morris was a very productive player, I don’t see the need to tear down somebody’s career in order to prove somebody else wrong. 254 Wins is very impressive, just let the guy into the HoF.
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
by SRB on Jan 9, 2012 9:54 PM CST up reply actions
I wish that was the only time his name came up
Some of us have to suffer through him on the Twins radio broadcasts.
Also, by rWAR he's behind Javier Vazquez, Brad Radke and Johan Santana.
Now that's great tasting chicken!
So the "Radke for the Hall" dealio was more legit than I thought?
That and someone tweeted, re Morris, that Scott Kazmir had a similar career FIP. I shuddered.
Tom Glavine seems like a better comparison to me (3.94 vs. 3.95 career FIP; workhorse; lots of Wins)
I don’t know if I would personally vote for either, but the anti-Morris vitriol is totally unnecessary. He defined an era for a lot of people, apparently, and that seems like a legitimate enough reason to let him in. I don’t think the Hall should be 100% numbers (e.g. Roger Maris didn’t have a superb career, but I think he should be in the Hall of Fame)
If Plush had to pick Wearwolf or Vampire, I'm a Wearwolf!
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